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Post by pw on Mar 28, 2011 10:51:04 GMT -5
Hi All, I'm new to the boards and fairly new to the current edition of 40K (I played the first couple of editions and then had a break until now). It turns out that I'm not so good at playing as I remember and that the game has changed a lot. Anyway, I need help, I'm playing against the Tyranids and the first three games haven't gone well. With some thinking about what's gone wrong so far, I've come up with this list and I'd be grateful for any comments:
Company CS (Plasma Pistol, 4 Plasma guns, Chimera – ML, HF)
Platoon CS (4 Flamers)
3 Infantry Squads (Grenade Launcher, Missile Launcher) 1 Commissar (Plasma Pistol, Power Sword)
2 Veteran Squads (3 Meltaguns, Chimera – ML, HF)
1 Vet Squad (3 Meltaguns, plasma pistol) (Will ride in a Vendetta)
1 Vendetta
1 Leman Russ Executioner (lascanon, Plasma Cannon sponsons)
1 Leman Russ Demolisher (Hull mounted HF)
Griffon (HF)
I think this is 1495 points.
[Edited to change Punisher to Executioner]
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Post by krasimirova on Mar 28, 2011 13:19:49 GMT -5
Well the list seems very good.. Alot of units that work well on paper.. Except the punisher (which is the worst tank we have, if not the worst unit we have..) I would put a Standard in instead of that piece of crap, with its str. 8 it will instant kill warriors and other T4 multi wound models.. Normally I wouldn't take meltaguns if i have the luxury of knowing that i am gonna play against nidz, plasmaguns are better because you can dish out more wounds.. Sure you will wound on 3+ instead of 2+, but you will have 2 shots, in my book that is worth much more.. I might consider droping the Griffon and use the points saved on the Punisher + some ekstra found around somewhere (powersword + Plasmapistol from blob squad + the lascannon from the hull on the std. leman + a ekstra plasma pistol from somewhere) then you can get a ekstra leman! Do that..  Other than that it seems like a pretty solid list... If you go to town with this list, all you need is experience and then you will start winning pretty fast.. Hope it helped.. Cheers Kras.. EDIT: Ohh and welcome to the IGMB, people will start harvesting your organs at some point.. |
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Post by pw on Mar 28, 2011 14:49:07 GMT -5
Thanks Kras, you've spotted my mistake (and evidence if it were needed that I'm not yet up to speed with the IG). I meant an Exectuioner, not a Punisher.
If I drop the plasma pistol from the Commissar I could swap meltaguns on one of the Chimera mounted Veteran Units for plasma guns. That would work for me as I've not bought that unit yet (although the idea of converting another three plasma gunners doesn't appeal much - I'm using Valhallans!).
What's the general thoughts on the Griffon? Worth ditching in favour of a standard Russ (if I can find the points)?
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Post by krasimirova on Mar 28, 2011 15:53:19 GMT -5
IMHO the griffon is inferior to the russ in every way.. (yes you can have 2 of them for the same price, and that would make the setup better..) I really enjoy the Leman.. So I might not be the best to ask.. Well fluff wise Valhallans use plasmas, but yes moding a plasmagun upto a valhallan model might be a bit tricky, and might take some going with the dremel..:/ Ahh Executioner, much much better choice than the Punisher.. |
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Post by WestRider on Mar 28, 2011 18:33:11 GMT -5
I really like Griffons, myself. Nice and cheap, and they can do a surprising amount of damage. Accurate Bombardment starts getting really nasty when you've got more than one in a Squadron. If you've got a Heavy Support slot open, they're well worth their Points.
I'd strip the gear off the Commissar to upgrade the Grenade Launchers in the Platoons, and maybe drop the Lascannon on the Executioner for Points as well, but other than that, this looks pretty decent for an anti-Nid list. I will second the suggestion of Plasma, it really is the best option against the big Bugs.
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Post by pw on Mar 29, 2011 3:37:51 GMT -5
Thanks Dux. What would you upgrade the grenade launchers to? Plasma? If I dropped the Commissar completely I could almost get another Griffon...
A slightly reworked list would get me to this:
Company CS (Plasma Pistol, 4 Plasma guns, Chimera – ML, HF)
Platoon CS (4 Flamers)
3 Infantry Squads (Grenade Launcher, Missile Launcher) 1 Commissar (Power Sword)
1 Veteran Squad (3 Meltaguns, Chimera – ML, HF)
1 Veteran Squad (3 plasmaguns, Chimera - ML, HF)
1 Vet Squad (3 Meltaguns, plasma pistol) (Will ride in a Vendetta)
1 Vendetta
1 Leman Russ Executioner (lascanon, Plasma Cannon sponsons)
1 Leman Russ Demolisher (Hull mounted HF)
Griffon (HF)
Or, I could go for:
Company CS (Plasma Pistol, 4 Plasma guns, Chimera – ML, HF)
Platoon CS (4 Flamers)
3 Infantry Squads (2 with Grenade Launchers and a Missile Launcher (merged), the other with a flamer.
1 Veteran Squad (3 Meltaguns, Chimera – ML, HF)
1 Veteran Squad (3 plasmaguns, Chimera - ML, HF)
1 Vet Squad (3 Meltaguns, plasma pistol) (Will ride in a Vendetta)
1 Vendetta
1 Leman Russ Executioner (Hull mounted HB, Plasma Cannon sponsons)
1 Leman Russ Demolisher (Hull mounted HF)
1 Leman Russ (Hull mounted HB)
or, option three:
Company CS (Plasma Pistol, 4 Plasma guns, Chimera – ML, HF)
Platoon CS (4 Flamers)
3 Infantry Squads (2 with Grenade Launchers and a Missile Launcher (merged), the other with a flamer.
1 Veteran Squad (3 Meltaguns, Chimera – ML, HF)
1 Veteran Squad (3 plasmaguns, Chimera - ML, HF)
1 Vet Squad (3 Meltaguns, plasma pistol) (Will ride in a Vendetta)
1 Vendetta
1 Leman Russ Executioner (Hvy Bolter, Plasma Cannon sponsons)
1 Leman Russ Demolisher (Hull mounted HF)
2 x Griffon (HF)
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Post by WestRider on Mar 29, 2011 10:32:18 GMT -5
Don't drop the Commissar entirely. The Nid Army can force penalties on Morale Checks from shooting, so the Stubborn is even more important there than against other Armies.
The Plasmagun is, in fact, my go-to Special Weapon for Infantry Squads with a Heavy Weapon. It can hit a lot of the same harder targets, and also works best while stationary. Grenade Launchers are for Squads that want some Mobility, but also need some Range. Objective Grabbers, basically.
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Post by pw on Mar 29, 2011 10:47:55 GMT -5
That combination (plasma and ML) makes good sense, thanks. Some more tinkering would get me to this
Company CS (Plasma Pistol, 4 Plasma guns, Chimera – ML, HF)
Platoon CS (3 Flamers)
3 Infantry Squads (Plasmagun, Missile Launcher), Commissar
1 Veteran Squad (3 Meltaguns, Chimera – ML, HF)
1 Veteran Squad (3 plasmaguns, Chimera - ML, HF)
1 Vet Squad (3 Meltaguns, plasma pistol) (Will ride in a Vendetta)
1 Vendetta
1 Leman Russ Executioner (Hull Mounted HB, Plasma Cannon sponsons)
1 Leman Russ Demolisher (Hull mounted HF)
Griffon (HF)
This does leave me with 6 more plasma gunners to convert and having done four so far I already know it's a job I hate!
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Post by WestRider on Mar 29, 2011 18:41:22 GMT -5
Yeah! There you go. That should nail you some Nids!
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Post by pw on Mar 30, 2011 10:06:55 GMT -5
Thanks for the help, now it looks like I've got no excuses if my next game goes pear shaped!
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Post by WestRider on Mar 30, 2011 10:09:10 GMT -5
Nah, you can always blame your Dice  |
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Post by pw on Apr 24, 2011 3:04:02 GMT -5
Had a chance to try this list out last night against a Tyranid army which it mashed up entirely for the loss of the Vendetta and one guardsman (plus the Demolisher that somehow shot itself along with six plasma gunners who exploded). The Nid player, who wasn't my normal Nid playing-opponent (who I'm yet to defeat with the IG), didn't manage to get into the game at all and so while the list was a major success in terms of winning it was a bit of a failure from the fun point of view. I'll run it against the other Nid army before deciding if it needs to be tweaked to make it less of a nightmare to face.
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Post by Empirespy on Apr 24, 2011 4:48:45 GMT -5
Yes I got here first!
*takes gene sample*
Haha! my first genesample
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Post by Walrus on Apr 24, 2011 5:57:39 GMT -5
*slaps empirespy*
Fool, you don't even have access to the gene banks...
*destroys empirespy's sample, takes own*
I can't really offer you advice, westrider has done a brilliant job.
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Post by Empirespy on Apr 24, 2011 6:40:31 GMT -5
Ooohhh!
what sort of nid army do you play against, do they use extended carapace, with out number or toxinsacs with their gaunts, this makes a big diference to what sort of list you take.
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Post by pw on Apr 24, 2011 13:37:56 GMT -5
The army I've had trouble with (it's thrashed me each time) is usually something like:
Trygon
Hive Tyrant
Tyranid prime
2 Units Tyranid Warriors (each with one pinning weapon)
3 hive guard
2 Units of Hormagaunts
2 Zoanthropes in a spore mine
1 Biovore
Tervigon
That has indeed got toxinsacs on the gaunts, and a large number of pinning shots that seem to work very well.
The army I faced with the above list had a larger proportion of smaller bugs. Something like:
Tyranid prime
3 hive guard
3 zoanthropes
20 termagaunts
20 Hormagants
20 genestealers..
Tervigon
2 Trygon
There were quite a few upgrades on the Nid creatures (certainly toxin sacs).
We're fairly new to this edition of 40K (having started with Rogue Trader and returned after a few missed editions) and it's going to be something of a learning curve getting the lists balanced in a way that will provide fun games. To be honest I'm not sure if the one-sided game we had was down to lists or down to my having around five games under my belt versus my friend's 0. One thing that we agreed on was that it wasn't luck, mine certainly wasn't bad but it wasn't stupidly good. Hopefully my next game, against my more experienced opponent will give me a better idea of how things stand. Am I a filthy power-gaming cheese-meister! Watch this space...
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Post by Walrus on Apr 24, 2011 18:20:30 GMT -5
That big bug list is EVIL!
I doubt your power gaming is a solid claim...
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Post by pw on Apr 25, 2011 13:58:36 GMT -5
According to the chatter on The Warhammer Forum I'm an evil monster for using this list! If only I had half the 40K skills that are implied by such a suggestion! I'm tending to agree with them there that my list is too tough.
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Post by Walrus on Apr 26, 2011 0:35:13 GMT -5
I don't think you are an evil list maker, as you are a new player in this edition. I liken this to more of a new player trying to have effective games.
I think a list like yours would put you in good standing in an area like Krasimirova's, where there is hard competition, but everybody does it so it is fun ;D
Now go get a game damn it, there are xeno to be purged.
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Post by pw on Apr 26, 2011 13:32:45 GMT -5
And purge them I will! My other 'Nid opponent fully deserves a mashing after several huge victories. Despite the success of my list last time out (in terms of winning not fun) I'm not sure if I'll pull a win off next time (he's a better player than me and seems to know how to put a dent in my Guardsmen) but I expect it'll be fun trying. If I do win big I'll have to scale things back a bit.
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Post by Walrus on Apr 27, 2011 0:32:23 GMT -5
If I was you, and I won big against him, I wouldn't scale back until I beat him at least twice in a row by a huge margin...
But then, if you feel bad about giving him a taste of his own medicine, of course you can scale it back.
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Post by pw on May 14, 2011 13:39:05 GMT -5
I finally got my game in against the Tyranids and I just to say won. We were playing the scenario where you have to capture an objective in the enemy's deployment zone and my infantry blob managed to hold off some flanking genestealers for just long enough (they ended up half an inch too far away to take it). I didn't capture his objective but he didn't manage to get any troops back to hold it either. My list worked well but it wasn't a whitewash and we both had fun. I think playing with Nids (or any combat oriented army) really demands that you hold your nerve as you watch your bugs dies on the way across the board in the knowledge that even if a few make it into combat you'll have a good time mashing guardsmen up. Thank the Emperor for Commissars!
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