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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2007 13:45:22 GMT -5
When should a platton be called full. I know its 5 but if that just two many? Plz tell more?
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Post by Commissar on Oct 4, 2007 23:59:52 GMT -5
I love a full platoon, its just plain fun. 55 men, have a few of those. Coolness.
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Post by Turtleboy(AWOL) on Oct 5, 2007 4:16:14 GMT -5
command squads are valuable. for that reason, I typically just run 25 man platoons. having a ton of line squads is decent, but if you run platoons of 55 dudes I guarantee you will run out of terrain and have guardsmen standing in the open fields screaming 'shoot me, I get no save!'
a typical battlefield with average terrain can usually support about 4 line squads and a reasonable compliment of heavy weapon teams. anything more than that and it better be carapace armored. that or you'd best be comfortable leaving it deployed in a second line where it has no line of fire and can't be hit other than by enemy artillery. I typically use a small conscript platoon for this.
large numbers of guard infantry are attractive on paper, but unless they have carapace armor are a real waste of assets. the baneblade may change this equation a bit since it will likely be such a fire magnet and there are arguments for fielding mass amounts of 'distracting units' like 3x hellhounds vs. an army with a bunch of 4+ armor save infantry. do things like this and you're likely to allow your infantry to go un-noticed or at least LESS noticed. same can be said for 3 leman russes vs. marines. they know they must take out the tanks before they are pieplated to death, however a marine player knows he's pretty safe just rushing half a dozen rhinos across the field since tanks can't kill smoked rhinos worth a darn. this is probably a scenario where mass guardsmen would seem advantageous, but remember the 'lack of cover' issue - you will proceed to lose whole squads of guardsmen to rifle fire cuz you get no save. then in cover you will be slaughtered due to marines 3+ to hit and 3+ to wound with you needing your 5+ save vs. you needing 4+ then 5+ and him only needing 3+ to live. the odds are very badly tipped for infantry to win vs. marines. it's about the tanks landing the big shells. massed infantry will give you one thing in a situation like this: a brutal rapid fire volley. unfortunately, if you have a ton of troops, falling back can get pretty hairy since you have troops as far as the eye can see (I'll eat dinner while you do your movement phase, see you in an hour, I trust you, honestly, no..no I don't want to watch you move 200 guardsmen.. ).
at any rate, 55 man platoons are great on paper, but unless you have a MASSIVE battlefield, I wouldn't consider it.
plus a command squad can be an awesome asset. special weapon squads for free - they're basically a free doctrine point. attach advisors to the melee oriented ones and you get a counterattack unit. give mortars to the fire support squads and they become first class babysitters for non-central firebases where heavy weapon squads are posted. there's just alot of uses for command squads and infantry is well off to have a good number of them in their ranks.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2007 11:47:37 GMT -5
I think for survivability that three squads is probably the best. It is large enough to put out the double tap of doom and do some damage, and it is still small enough to occupy cover and not crowd a piece of cover. Also if you have a heavy weapon in one squad you can still bound up and take ground with the other two squads.
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Post by Commissar on Oct 10, 2007 21:58:35 GMT -5
Well its not like they have to be deployed next to eachother or anything, they can go seperate.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2007 10:32:48 GMT -5
That's true, but I like to keep an Officer near by to bolster up the morale. Iron discipline rules. And with larger platoons it just seems like that would be a very difficult thing to do, seeing as how you would have fewer command squads, unless you bunched up a lot. Also I like to fire one of my platoons on one of my enemies troop choices, very rarely will a platoon be out numbered on a troop choice basis (unless its nids). So having a medium sized unit means I can have a few more and maintain good firepower.
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Post by Commissar on Oct 11, 2007 21:52:01 GMT -5
Yeah thats true. Its all cool.
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Post by Sappmer on Oct 12, 2007 2:12:56 GMT -5
In the Apocalypse Rule book (which I got last week) it says that there are about three squads in a plattoon and there are three platoons.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2007 6:54:09 GMT -5
25 men is good in 1000-1500pt games, 35 for 2000 and above points. Any more than 35 men and your platoon is huge mass of meanless cannon fodder. Thats what Conscripts are for anyway!
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Post by Rolling Thunder on Oct 12, 2007 9:30:30 GMT -5
3 line squads,JO with powerfist and com. squad with 3-4 meltas/plasmas. Have at you vile Beakies!
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Post by twerd on Oct 17, 2007 0:46:16 GMT -5
i say three 30 guard is a nice group for doing what needs to be done
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Post by Commissar on Oct 17, 2007 16:43:17 GMT -5
I usually take a full 55. Its just so much fun!
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Post by Colonel Grammissar Azalar on Oct 17, 2007 17:34:59 GMT -5
If you read any Gaunts Ghost Book, A Platoon is a full 55 men, which means 5 squads of 10 and a command squad.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2007 16:19:53 GMT -5
That maybe true if you come from Tanith, I guess. Most of the guardsmen in the black library books die in droves and don't really strike me a real professional soldiers (some exceptions do apply.) Back on topic, I just wouldn't want to put down 55 guardsmen in one setting while deploying. My friends already go grab lunch and sodas while I set up my three squad platoons. Also once again there just isn't enough cover in one battlefield to protect one of those platoons. Also template weapons would frak your guys good.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2007 8:41:42 GMT -5
I like either 3 full squads or 2 and a remnant squad.I also use C.O.D. since my main army is valhallen so i'm pretty well jammed together.It's pretty good for counter assault if any one ever gets close enough. anything more than that and people start to wanter off while you are deploying your troops.You start to hear things like " how many squads are in your troop choice? !!!!" or" i'm just going to deploy the rest of my army while you put down your first troop".I usually head that last one from young kids with no attention span playing necrons or marines.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2007 9:42:30 GMT -5
i voted the 3 squads in a platoon, times that by 2 to make your basic troop choice and you're looking at a heck lot of troops. My pltoons usually lay down a static line in the middle of the board....with 6 squads covering the middle board, it gives me room for attacking units to start flanking the enemy or to counter charge an onrushing assault on the main lines
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Post by Colonel Grammissar Azalar on Oct 29, 2007 9:51:59 GMT -5
If you read any Gaunts Ghost Book, A Platoon is a full 55 men, which means 5 squads of 10 and a command squad. Got the two new gaunts ghosts books today Anyway. A good platoon is a full platoon, all them men and all that, it dosent really matter how many squads are in the platoon, thats really for deploymeny, as one platoon = one troops choice.
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Post by mardaddy on Nov 2, 2007 17:22:19 GMT -5
If it matters, and it doesn't, a USMC Infantry Platoon is *supposed to be* three squads of 12 with a 4-man HQ (Plt Cmdr, PltSgt, Platoon Guide and Corpsman for 40pax tot. I have seen four and five squads of 12 in a Platoon, bringing it to as many as 64pax, but never only two squads. Not that in the 40k univ, 2 squads in an Infantry platoon does not have its good and bad tactical points, just IRL, the two squads would be broken up to join other platoons, making them four squad platoons.
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Post by 9th Company on Nov 3, 2007 6:45:34 GMT -5
I`d go with a 35 man platoon. After all, this is the 41st Millenium and there is only war (as the saying goes). How often would a Guard platoon be full strenght? Not very often. A under strenght platoon gives the impression its seen a lot of combat.
Plus a platoon with 3 squads and a command unit fits quite nicely with the British army way of doing things.
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Post by Commissar on Nov 4, 2007 1:59:41 GMT -5
Yeah but there are always replacements!!! LoL. I like the full platoons, very russkie conscription is mandatory typo thing.
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Post by twerd on Nov 4, 2007 2:53:47 GMT -5
no conscript platoons are very russie just one large unit
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2007 11:14:49 GMT -5
I play with 55 man platoons. Simple reason, I play mordian and I stand back and shoot. Who cares if I lose a few. I useally have 115+ guys on the table before I start throwing in tanks. Yes it takes me forever to deploy and I fill up my deployment zone and template weapons make their points back. But nothing and I mean nothing compares to unloading on termies with 50 lasguns and watching them die
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Post by The Refined Gentleman (M.I.A) on Nov 4, 2007 14:24:55 GMT -5
3 squads i rekon, as it provides numbers to overunn the enemy and still allows you space in your deployment zone
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2007 17:53:48 GMT -5
I try to shoot as often as possible, but sometimes you need to take ground. I usually keep two maneuver squads, one with a melta gun one with a plasma gun and then I use my other squad which usually has a heavy bolter and use them as a base of fire. Also that formation can lay down serious fire power, and take the return fire. Also the smaller formation frees up points to put into other things like sents' or Russes, or just more platoons.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2007 20:33:07 GMT -5
To be Honest I have a full 55 man paltoon, for fluff reasons, the size of the Platoons you field gives an idea of your Regements size. Having said that however I have yet to play a game large enough to use all 5 infantry squads (i have to match points with my opponents and they are loath to go to high points wise lest they face the IG tank wave). I usually end up only being able to field 3 squads + Command Squads, and an armored fist squad(love the amount of fire the chimeara puts out).
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