Post by akaiyou on May 26, 2010 20:18:09 GMT -5
I'd like to take it one Force Organization Branch at a time per thread starting with the Heavy Support choices in this one. A different thread for HQs and so on..
And what we'll do will be comparing the options in each FO slot and discussing the pros/cons of their 'options'
Also if possible when you make a post and then later decide to 'add' or change information instead of making a new post try to just edit the current one this will save time for people reading through your thoughts if it's all in one post rather than scattered about through the thread.
HEAVY SUPPORT
TYRANNOFEX
Overview
- I found that this unit was a hit or miss. Much like it's ballistic skill it could go either way in terms of usefulness during a game. It simply doesnt do enough in combat, it's slow and it's ranged weaponry leaves something to be desired. It's highlight seems to be it's defense.
PROS
CONS
Options
Ranged
Fleshborer Hive - Looks amazing on paper, but has very little use on the battlefield. It's a glorified batch of 20 gaunts worth of shooting. When was the last time 20 gaunts shooting won you a game? Horrible upgrade.
Rupture Cannon - Probably it's best weapon for it's massive range and strength by Nid standards. This our ranged can-opener. But comes with a hefty price.
Acid Spray - Comes standard and is useful, it would be much better if the Tyrannofex was actually good in combat. However you must consider that running up close enough to use this flamer is no easy task. This makes it a major downside however Acid Spray is much better than Fleshborerhive.
Stinger Salvo - Sucks, only 4 shots hitting 50% of the time at S5 makes this a very poor choice.
Cluster Spines - Much better than Stinger Salvo since it's not handicapped by the ballistic skill and can hit many enemies at a time, works great at clearing crowds of low T, poor armour infantry.
Optional
Thorax Weapons - They all compliment acid spray really well and Fleshborer Hive, but lose value paired with Rupture Cannon.
- Grubs version - Good strength means it works really well paired with Acid Spray as they will normally do good against same targets.
- Beetles version - Avoid it, the rending seems nice but low strength and low chance to actually rend makes it pointless.
- Larvae version - Great choice, you most likely wont be flaming vehicles anyway, so it best with Acid Spray since you'll wound most targets on 2s with both.
Biomorphs
Regeneration - Great choice for any MC with 6 wounds, this is a general rule that applies to all of them. Gives the most bang for the buck.
Adrenal Glands - A bit pointless the bonuses you get from Furious Charge won't make much of a difference against most targets. S7 and I2 is only useful if you are assaulting vehicles up close or if u want to try and nail that power first before it hits.
Toxin Sacs - Worst choice possible, actually makes the Tyrannofex worst. There aren't enough T7+ enemies in the game to make TS worth while for a Tyrannofex.
TRYGON
Overview
- After extensive use of the Trygon and Trygon Prime i've grown to like them more compared to my initial thoughts that they were horrible and only good for being fire magnets and a points sink. The Trygon must be used strategically i realized, so do not be fooled by his size and how mean he looks, he's still a gaunt at heart. Treat him with care and he will reward you greatly. This is definetly one of the better choices to fill up those Heavy Support slots.
PROS
CONS
To Prime Or Not To Prime
- Absolutely. The Prime adds Synapse which is always a plus in most cases and it provides stronger ranged weaponry. At 40 pts a piece this may not seem worth it, but remember the Trygon standard has average leadership and suffers from IB. This means his Ld value can be abused by any wise opponent so being able to deny this exploit and also support the rest of your army is a great benefit gained.
Ranged
- There aren't any options, other than getting a Prime. So I'll just cover this by stating that the standard load out isn't very good or reliable. Short range and BS 3 pretty much makes it crap. The Trygon Prime doubles the shot output and increases range making the weapon decent i've been able to use it on many occasions whilst i've yet to find use for the standard load out's ranged firepower.
Biomorphs
Adrenal Glands - Yes, it's a good choice to get your licks in before anything at I4 and the Trygon has the speed to ensure you get the charge in most cases. So it's a good deal and helps with vehicles.
Regeneration - Yes, same general rule applies 6 wounds is ideal for Regen.
Toxin Sacs - Steer away from the sacs with anything S6 because it'll decrease your combat power when you would be wounding on 2s (83% success) you'll drop to (75%) and all this to tackle the very few T6+ enemies in the game. Which you can bog down with other things.
OLD ONE EYE
Overview
- I do not own any models and don't have anything suitable for proxy (no i will not use the current Carnifex model for it bleh) So I have no data on him, however I am considering running it in some Vassal games just to get a few words to put on here about him if possible.
MAWLOC
Overview
- Hit or miss unit, it's a gamble however this is one of the 'better' gambles that you can make with the tyranid army. It's affordable and if it works can pay off big time in more ways than one.
PROS
CONS
Biomorphs
Adrenal Glands - Avoid, it's not a bad upgrade because it can help pop vehicles open and/or improve your chances in combat however the Mawloc simply isn't good enough to do heavy damage in 1 round of combat and it has the strength to pry vehicles open without needing furious charge.
Regeneration - Yes, same general rule applies 6 wounds is ideal for Regen.
Toxin Sacs - Steer away from the sacs with anything S6 because it'll decrease your combat power when you would be wounding on 2s (83% success) you'll drop to (75%) and all this to tackle the very few T6+ enemies in the game. Which you can bog down with other thing
CARNIFEX
Overview
- Neutered since last codex. Or is it called re-balanced? Any how the Carnifex is an empty shell of it's former self, however this doesn't mean that it sucks completely, as it is the most versatile of heavy support choices and that can take it a long way.
PROS
CONS
Close Combat Weapons
Crushing Claws - Suck because of the random chance and lowered initiative. Don't take it.
Scything Talons - Great and comes by default making it even better. Able to re-roll missed hits against anything.
Ranged Weapons
Twin-Linked Brainleech Worms - More powerful, but pretty expensive. Worth the price tag? Yes, if u can afford it.
Twin-Linked Deathspitters - N/A
Stranglethorn Cannon - N/A
Heavy Venom Cannon - A mixed bag, on one hand it is more reliable and able to pop tanks, but lowered chance to hit and less strength to pack a punch as well as being 1 shot only versus vehicles. Can be worth it but there's better set ups.
Biomorphs
Adrenal Glands - Good upgrade if you want to focus on close combat this can aid the carnifexes initiative and strength values greatly.
Bio-Plasma - Decent upgrade, it's only downside is that it has short range and is not cheap to take. But killing just 1 terminator with it earns it's points back.
Frag Spines - Good upgrade for combat oriented carnifexes.
Regeneration - No, too expensive and doesn't get much mileage since 1 carnifex is very easy to kill in 1 turn of shooting.
Toxin Sacs - Worst possible unit to use toxin sacs on since it's high strength already allows it to wound just about anything on 2+
Transport Options
Mycetic Spore - Sweet, not a must-have but a very very good way of disrupting the enemy forces works the best when used with carnifexes equipped with a pair of Twin-Linked Brainleech Worms allowing you to shoot and then charge into combat the next turn. Only downside to a spore is that your fex will suffer IB most likely and only 1 Carnifex fits in one.
BIOVORES
Overview
- Great improvement over previous codex. These guys are what the rest of the Heavy Support choices should've been like in terms of overall value. Highly recommended.
PROS
CONS
OVERALL RANKING [Based on my PERSONAL OPINION]
1. Biovore - Best heavy support choice can maul infantry easily, deny cover, pin them. Just make sure your army can deal with tanks either with zoanthropes, hive guards or other means.
2. Trygon Prime - The added synapse really does help a lot if you want no zoanthropes as elites or want your troops to include no warriors/tervigons.
3. Mawloc - Let's admit it, when it works it pretty much means lights out for the opponent.
4. Carnifex - If you can keep them cheap and get them within range they'll put on a world of hurt on the enemy.
5. Trygon - Still decent but pricey.
6. Tyrannofex - MUST take Rupture Cannon otherwise it becomes nearly unplayable with it's poor close range stats.
7. Old One Eye - Needs play testing before I form any opinion on him.
And what we'll do will be comparing the options in each FO slot and discussing the pros/cons of their 'options'
Also if possible when you make a post and then later decide to 'add' or change information instead of making a new post try to just edit the current one this will save time for people reading through your thoughts if it's all in one post rather than scattered about through the thread.
HEAVY SUPPORT
TYRANNOFEX
Overview
- I found that this unit was a hit or miss. Much like it's ballistic skill it could go either way in terms of usefulness during a game. It simply doesnt do enough in combat, it's slow and it's ranged weaponry leaves something to be desired. It's highlight seems to be it's defense.
PROS
- Extremely durable
- Longest ranged anti-vehicle we can get
CONS
- BS 3 and not enough shoots
- Other ranged weaponry has crap range
- Doesn't pack enough punch for the price tag
- Sucks as much as a Tervigon in close combat
Options
Ranged
Fleshborer Hive - Looks amazing on paper, but has very little use on the battlefield. It's a glorified batch of 20 gaunts worth of shooting. When was the last time 20 gaunts shooting won you a game? Horrible upgrade.
Rupture Cannon - Probably it's best weapon for it's massive range and strength by Nid standards. This our ranged can-opener. But comes with a hefty price.
Acid Spray - Comes standard and is useful, it would be much better if the Tyrannofex was actually good in combat. However you must consider that running up close enough to use this flamer is no easy task. This makes it a major downside however Acid Spray is much better than Fleshborerhive.
Stinger Salvo - Sucks, only 4 shots hitting 50% of the time at S5 makes this a very poor choice.
Cluster Spines - Much better than Stinger Salvo since it's not handicapped by the ballistic skill and can hit many enemies at a time, works great at clearing crowds of low T, poor armour infantry.
Optional
Thorax Weapons - They all compliment acid spray really well and Fleshborer Hive, but lose value paired with Rupture Cannon.
- Grubs version - Good strength means it works really well paired with Acid Spray as they will normally do good against same targets.
- Beetles version - Avoid it, the rending seems nice but low strength and low chance to actually rend makes it pointless.
- Larvae version - Great choice, you most likely wont be flaming vehicles anyway, so it best with Acid Spray since you'll wound most targets on 2s with both.
Biomorphs
Regeneration - Great choice for any MC with 6 wounds, this is a general rule that applies to all of them. Gives the most bang for the buck.
Adrenal Glands - A bit pointless the bonuses you get from Furious Charge won't make much of a difference against most targets. S7 and I2 is only useful if you are assaulting vehicles up close or if u want to try and nail that power first before it hits.
Toxin Sacs - Worst choice possible, actually makes the Tyrannofex worst. There aren't enough T7+ enemies in the game to make TS worth while for a Tyrannofex.
TRYGON
Overview
- After extensive use of the Trygon and Trygon Prime i've grown to like them more compared to my initial thoughts that they were horrible and only good for being fire magnets and a points sink. The Trygon must be used strategically i realized, so do not be fooled by his size and how mean he looks, he's still a gaunt at heart. Treat him with care and he will reward you greatly. This is definetly one of the better choices to fill up those Heavy Support slots.
PROS
- Fire Magnet, can easily draw fire away from other units
- Has fleet
- Can be a synapse creature if needed
- Has an alternate method of deployment just in case
CONS
- Fire Magnet, it wont live very long
- Can't assault when using alternate deployment
- Very difficult to gain cover benefits with
To Prime Or Not To Prime
- Absolutely. The Prime adds Synapse which is always a plus in most cases and it provides stronger ranged weaponry. At 40 pts a piece this may not seem worth it, but remember the Trygon standard has average leadership and suffers from IB. This means his Ld value can be abused by any wise opponent so being able to deny this exploit and also support the rest of your army is a great benefit gained.
Ranged
- There aren't any options, other than getting a Prime. So I'll just cover this by stating that the standard load out isn't very good or reliable. Short range and BS 3 pretty much makes it crap. The Trygon Prime doubles the shot output and increases range making the weapon decent i've been able to use it on many occasions whilst i've yet to find use for the standard load out's ranged firepower.
Biomorphs
Adrenal Glands - Yes, it's a good choice to get your licks in before anything at I4 and the Trygon has the speed to ensure you get the charge in most cases. So it's a good deal and helps with vehicles.
Regeneration - Yes, same general rule applies 6 wounds is ideal for Regen.
Toxin Sacs - Steer away from the sacs with anything S6 because it'll decrease your combat power when you would be wounding on 2s (83% success) you'll drop to (75%) and all this to tackle the very few T6+ enemies in the game. Which you can bog down with other things.
OLD ONE EYE
Overview
- I do not own any models and don't have anything suitable for proxy (no i will not use the current Carnifex model for it bleh) So I have no data on him, however I am considering running it in some Vassal games just to get a few words to put on here about him if possible.
MAWLOC
Overview
- Hit or miss unit, it's a gamble however this is one of the 'better' gambles that you can make with the tyranid army. It's affordable and if it works can pay off big time in more ways than one.
PROS
- Alternate method of deployment that causes heavy damage to infantry and vehicles alike
- Special ability can affect multiple units
- S6 Monstrous Creature so always a thread to vehicles
- Hit & Run to save it from being locked in combat
- Very affordable
CONS
- Weak in combat
- Fire Magnet
- It's special ability is only guaranteed 33.3% of the time
Biomorphs
Adrenal Glands - Avoid, it's not a bad upgrade because it can help pop vehicles open and/or improve your chances in combat however the Mawloc simply isn't good enough to do heavy damage in 1 round of combat and it has the strength to pry vehicles open without needing furious charge.
Regeneration - Yes, same general rule applies 6 wounds is ideal for Regen.
Toxin Sacs - Steer away from the sacs with anything S6 because it'll decrease your combat power when you would be wounding on 2s (83% success) you'll drop to (75%) and all this to tackle the very few T6+ enemies in the game. Which you can bog down with other thing
CARNIFEX
Overview
- Neutered since last codex. Or is it called re-balanced? Any how the Carnifex is an empty shell of it's former self, however this doesn't mean that it sucks completely, as it is the most versatile of heavy support choices and that can take it a long way.
PROS
- Superb versatility
- Can take many options
- Can form broods
- Can use mycetic spores
- Incredible Strength
- Is good at combat no matter what direction you go with it
CONS
- Expensive
- Broods must be equipped all the same
- Vulnerable fire magnet
- Only 4 wounds
Close Combat Weapons
Crushing Claws - Suck because of the random chance and lowered initiative. Don't take it.
Scything Talons - Great and comes by default making it even better. Able to re-roll missed hits against anything.
Ranged Weapons
Twin-Linked Brainleech Worms - More powerful, but pretty expensive. Worth the price tag? Yes, if u can afford it.
Twin-Linked Deathspitters - N/A
Stranglethorn Cannon - N/A
Heavy Venom Cannon - A mixed bag, on one hand it is more reliable and able to pop tanks, but lowered chance to hit and less strength to pack a punch as well as being 1 shot only versus vehicles. Can be worth it but there's better set ups.
Biomorphs
Adrenal Glands - Good upgrade if you want to focus on close combat this can aid the carnifexes initiative and strength values greatly.
Bio-Plasma - Decent upgrade, it's only downside is that it has short range and is not cheap to take. But killing just 1 terminator with it earns it's points back.
Frag Spines - Good upgrade for combat oriented carnifexes.
Regeneration - No, too expensive and doesn't get much mileage since 1 carnifex is very easy to kill in 1 turn of shooting.
Toxin Sacs - Worst possible unit to use toxin sacs on since it's high strength already allows it to wound just about anything on 2+
Transport Options
Mycetic Spore - Sweet, not a must-have but a very very good way of disrupting the enemy forces works the best when used with carnifexes equipped with a pair of Twin-Linked Brainleech Worms allowing you to shoot and then charge into combat the next turn. Only downside to a spore is that your fex will suffer IB most likely and only 1 Carnifex fits in one.
BIOVORES
Overview
- Great improvement over previous codex. These guys are what the rest of the Heavy Support choices should've been like in terms of overall value. Highly recommended.
PROS
- Great range
- Very affordable
- Very damaging against most infantry
- Even if it misses it can still do damage as the spores linger on the table
CONS
- Vulnerable to instant death from a great deal of weapons
- Hitting the intended target is a gamble
- Weak to Useless against vehicles
- Very weak vs close combat for a Tyranid
OVERALL RANKING [Based on my PERSONAL OPINION]
1. Biovore - Best heavy support choice can maul infantry easily, deny cover, pin them. Just make sure your army can deal with tanks either with zoanthropes, hive guards or other means.
2. Trygon Prime - The added synapse really does help a lot if you want no zoanthropes as elites or want your troops to include no warriors/tervigons.
3. Mawloc - Let's admit it, when it works it pretty much means lights out for the opponent.
4. Carnifex - If you can keep them cheap and get them within range they'll put on a world of hurt on the enemy.
5. Trygon - Still decent but pricey.
6. Tyrannofex - MUST take Rupture Cannon otherwise it becomes nearly unplayable with it's poor close range stats.
7. Old One Eye - Needs play testing before I form any opinion on him.
