Hookah, S.C.
Colonel
Mostly Harmless
25%
But what if I put more plasma on it?
Posts: 390
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Post by Hookah, S.C. on Dec 7, 2011 20:12:54 GMT -5
They seem to be busily doing it. There new releases have been full of 'retro' SM stuff.
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Post by mccaptain on Dec 8, 2011 1:25:12 GMT -5
I've heard that the new starter box may include CSM and Eldar....
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connor
Captain
who needs samuria?
Posts: 167
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Post by connor on Dec 8, 2011 10:50:02 GMT -5
I've heard that the new starter box may include CSM and Eldar.... im actually OK with that. i would like to see some more CSM and Eldar player around my place.
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Post by 3ff3ct on Dec 13, 2011 17:05:13 GMT -5
I reckon that it would be a good time to launch a spin off of 40K, during the great crusade, using the standard 40k rules but like an expansion, like apocalypse. That would be cool. Warhammer 30,000: In The Grim Darkness Of The Future There Is Only War (Followed By A Bit More War)
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Post by ElegaicRequiem on Dec 13, 2011 20:14:51 GMT -5
Warhammer 30K: when the Imperium used XP.
Warhammer 40K: they switched to Vista.
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Post by Trooper One-Nine-Seven-Four on Dec 17, 2011 19:44:33 GMT -5
Warhammer 30K: when the Imperium used XP. Warhammer 40K: they switched to Vista. So after the Golden Throne dies, will they then be using Windows 7?
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Post by ElegaicRequiem on Dec 17, 2011 22:17:44 GMT -5
Warhammer 30K: when the Imperium used XP. Warhammer 40K: they switched to Vista. So after the Golden Throne dies, will they then be using Windows 7? No, they'll have to make due with Linux. Or some kind of Tau Mac.
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Post by Trooper One-Nine-Seven-Four on Jan 11, 2012 14:13:19 GMT -5
There is apparently a leaked copy of the 6th edition rules, and codex updates that hit the 'net yesterday...
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Post by BG. Foster on Jan 11, 2012 14:38:59 GMT -5
has any one managed to get hold of a copy yet? i've been having a look around for it and found people talking. there seems to be a lot of changes. i will continue my search for it
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Post by Trooper One-Nine-Seven-Four on Jan 11, 2012 14:43:44 GMT -5
has any one managed to get hold of a copy yet? i've been having a look around for it and found people talking. there seems to be a lot of changes. i will continue my search for it Foster, check your PMs.
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Post by KRIEGEIRK on Jan 11, 2012 16:07:01 GMT -5
Well we've officially reached the 41st millenium fluff wise in 5th. So we are either going to go back in time or ahead to Warhammer 50k FW has been releasing a lot of old school stuff, like the Contemptor Dread, and various SM Landraiders, etc. again all the focus is on SM's yawn... I would like to see some more Crusades or Heresy stuff.
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Post by Empirespy on Jan 11, 2012 16:34:59 GMT -5
Maybe GW will do that, all the heresy stuff is actually better, and they found a fully functional STC, and so they are now ready to go on new crusades. Mmmmmm guardsmen with conversion beamers...
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Post by RedsandRoyals on Jan 11, 2012 17:17:26 GMT -5
So, I'm reading through this thing now. I'll edit in updates as I go. Take all this with a grain of salt, since I might be misunderstanding some of this.
So far what grabs me is the new shooting rules. Much like WS is compared to your opponent's WS to hit, BS is now compared to your target's "evasion', which depends on their movement. I'm pretty sure this was done to accommodate fliers.
There's something now called a "Rigid" save, for particularly study creatures (I imagine MCs or Nids in general). If the target with the Rigid save is struck by a weapon that would not cause instant death, and has an high AP (so, not an ML or Melta), they get this save in addition to whatever save they may take. FnP is considered a "Rigid' save.
Wound Allocation has changed significantly. Instead of being governed by wargear and the like, it's now based on armour saves. Everyone with the same type of armour save is considered to be one "group", so a unit with an Inquisitor in power armour and some acolytes in Flak would be two "groups", and you allocate saves to each group by the number of wounds, not models, in the group. The player taking the saves chooses which models are casualties, so you can fail three saves, and decide to stick a wound on an officer and kill two goons.
Instant Death got a revision, and is now dependent on how much the weapon's strength exceeds the target's toughness. We can't kill an SM Captain outright with Str 8 weapons now. Eternal Warrior is modded to negate different levels of Instant Death.
Fall back moves are now base movement +d6.
Shaken replaces pinned, and vehicle shaken. From the sound of it, you can still perform a single shooting action per turn, and it looks like you can still move.
According to the ATSKNF caption, broken units that are within 12in of an enemy unit at the start of their next movement phase after being broken are destroyed. I'm going to check on this when I get to the appropriate section.
Difficult Terrain does not impede normal movement, it just prevents running, flat out, etc.
I'll post more later if I have time.
Reds
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Post by Trooper One-Nine-Seven-Four on Jan 11, 2012 17:56:42 GMT -5
Units now have different movement rates based on whether they are infantry, bikes, etc. Fleet adds a bonus to the unit's base movement rate. Assault now happens before shooting. Sweeping advance has become super brutal. Basically if you lose close combat and break & run, your squad gets away on a 5+. If your initiative is better than the enemies chasing you, your squad gets away on a 4+. Otherwise you get run down. It appears that certain special weapons can now be used as an additional close combat weapon if the model carrying it has a CCW. Power weapons can now be used to parry, granting the wielder a 5+ invulnerable save (don't remember if PFs can do this too, or if it's only swords and axes). Directed attacks: Models with this attribute can declare what model their attacks hit--so you can pick out squad leaders, special, and heavy weapons. Swarms have Eternal Warrior, but are still vulnerable to blasts and templates. Rail weapons seem to work like JotWW now: you place a marker, draw a line, place a second marker and the unit hit takes as many hits as their are models under the line. Superheavies, Titans, and fliers are in.
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Post by Julian Sharps on Jan 11, 2012 18:41:47 GMT -5
From what I've been able to figure, it looks like JSJ is no longer restricted to jet infantry and Eldar Jetbikes; any unit that can shoot more than one weapon can do so, at the expense of a shooting action.
Also, units strong at both assaults and shooting (as well as hit-and-run units) appear to be capable of attacking more than one unit in a turn due to the change in the turn sequence. Hellions (and possibly Swooping Hawks, I forget whether they have hit-and-run) are going to be nasty this edition, providing that these rumors prove to be true.
Furthermore, it seems that pistols no longer provide an extra attack in assault, but instead become special close combat weapons with their shooting attack profile. Dark Eldar just got a huge leg up against Tyranids with the prospect of poisoned close combat attacks as standard on two Troops unit types (AP 5 close combat attacks on Wyches).
I love what they did with fixing kill points; a die roll at the start of the game determines how many kill points a given unit is worth based on its point cost (I believe that they were in 40, 50 and 70 point brackets, making the average Guard infantry squad between 1 and 2 KPs, compared to the average Space Marine Tac squad's 2-5), and i think it's cool that the number of objectives is based on the game's point level, but I wish that objective VPs were awarded in the Consolidation Phase instead of the Movement Phase in order to make it less certain that your movement push got you to your objective, and the whole "VPs per objective per turn" thing kinda cramps the play style of a lot of Eldar and Dark Eldar builds, which tend to rely on beating face for 5 turns before a mad last-turn objective rush.
All in all, though, I likey. I likey lots.
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Post by RedsandRoyals on Jan 11, 2012 19:02:14 GMT -5
@sharps: As far as I can tell, Pistols still do gain that +1 attack. I haven't read their CC rules, but in figuring bonus attacks, it says two single handed weapons, and pistols apply to that.
So, more stuff.
Stratagems for normal missions have returned, allowing minefields and the like. It relates somehow to a bidding system to get the first turn, but the whole thing was too convoluted for me to understand just skimming it.
Valks are now rape. They can fire six different weapons if they sit still, so maybe those Hellstrikes are worth it.
SPECIAL RULES. SO MANY SPECIAL RULES! Every unit type now has at least four or five special rules, in addition to those units that have their own. Several of these special rules have different levels, meaning they gain better versions of the abilities with increasing levels. There are also several variations on single rules, like Deepstrike.
Snipers finally don't suck so hard. They still wound as usual, but can make called shots.
Time will tell if this is the actual 6th Ed (It badly needs to be proofread, and I can see them revising these rules), but I'm not exactly keen on it, particularly shooting happening after assault. I'll need to play a game or five with it though before I can really say I do (or don't) like it. I will say it seems to have gotten a lot more complex, and I'm prepared to call Blood Angels the big winner of this edition.
Reds
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Post by jenburdoo on Jan 11, 2012 19:26:53 GMT -5
Anything in it about changes to the force organization chart?
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Post by Julian Sharps on Jan 11, 2012 19:27:38 GMT -5
Also, apparently template weapons can be used to make d6 auto-hit attacks in close combat on the turn the model charges. Oh, the pain...
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Post by RedsandRoyals on Jan 11, 2012 19:29:03 GMT -5
Anything in it about changes to the force organization chart? Not that I could tell. The graphic of the chart itself is missing. Reds
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Post by Trickstick on Jan 11, 2012 19:45:04 GMT -5
Ack, too much reading to do. However, I have gleaned a few things:
Leman russes can't ram any more, as lumbering prevents all other vehicle movement special rules.
I think that the 3" "Move Move Move" is in addition to whatever you want to run. So Guardsmen can get up a decent speed.
Cover saves are now 5+ standard.
Although I think that this document needs to be taken with slug-genocide levels of sodium chloride.
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Hookah, S.C.
Colonel
Mostly Harmless
25%
But what if I put more plasma on it?
Posts: 390
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Post by Hookah, S.C. on Jan 11, 2012 19:58:29 GMT -5
I've had a skim, it seems kinda amateur, not really GW-y. Especially in making the rules more complicated..
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Post by RedsandRoyals on Jan 11, 2012 19:59:52 GMT -5
Ack, too much reading to do. However, I have gleaned a few things: Leman russes can't ram any more, as lumbering prevents all other vehicle movement special rules. I think that the 3" "Move Move Move" is in addition to whatever you want to run. So Guardsmen can get up a decent speed. Cover saves are now 5+ standard. Although I think that this document needs to be taken with slug-genocide levels of sodium chloride. That last statement is the big one to take away from this thread. Even if this was the real thing, it's clearly not a finished product. I will say, from my skimming, it seems like a Turducken of previous editions, Necromunda/Dark Heresy, and Apoc and other supplements, with a stuffing consisting of needlessly complex ideas, and glazed with a light sauce of good ideas. Then again, I'm of the 'If it ain't broke, don't try to fix it' school of rules development for game systems, so that's just me. Reds
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Post by Trickstick on Jan 11, 2012 20:03:05 GMT -5
Um, did anyone else notice the two units used to compare stats at the beginning are IG vet and chaos SM?
Given that in 5th they are ork and sm, do you think this is a hint at the new "Black Reach" contents?
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Post by RedsandRoyals on Jan 11, 2012 20:09:33 GMT -5
We can only hope.
I also noticed SM having a 2+ save in one example, and the Russ being 14 12 10, though, so we'll see. The more I read, the more I think it's a hoax.
Reds
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Post by Trickstick on Jan 11, 2012 20:13:23 GMT -5
I don't think that it is a hoax, just a release of a very old version.
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