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Post by tagakoner on Jul 31, 2012 16:42:24 GMT -5
Hi guys!
Now me and my group of friends have been playing Deathwatch for a while now, and are really enjoying it. Though now I see that they made Only War, and from the little I saw from the beta, it seems really great.
So what I was wondering is what are you guy's thoughts or experiences of it.
I heard there are quite a few differences from deathwatch, like the regimental stuff and how the vehicles work, how do you guys find it, and what do you prefer?
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Post by Melissia on Jul 31, 2012 20:13:15 GMT -5
well, AFAIK I'm the only one here who has both run a game as GM and played as a character, but dunno if you want to listen to me.
In character creation, the biggest differences are Aptitudes, which are determined by class and regiment, and which determine how much XP you pay for everything. Almost every talent and skill is available to every class-- the main restrictions being techpriest-only skills and psyker-only skills. There is no restriction on when you can buy anything-- as long as you meet the prerequisites and have the XP to spend, you can buy it any time you want.
Skills can be taken up to +30.
In combat, a few differences. The basic attacks-- standard, semiauto/swift, fullauto/lightning-- are half actions now. Standard attacks gain +10 to hit, fullauto/lightning gain -10 to hit. Parry and dodge are both skills, and how many attacks you dodge or parry is dependent on how good your roll was. Leap Aside lets you roll a second evasion. Accurate is far more powerful now, as are many neglected weapons which are classic Guard weapons.
Vehicles are better integrated as well, although I haven't had a good chance to play with them.
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Post by RedsandRoyals on Jul 31, 2012 21:22:28 GMT -5
I've played with the system and given it some stress tests. The issue is that since it's still beta, it changes every week or so, but in general, your guys will be normal, and will stay normal until they get a very large chunk of xp under their belt. Stat boosts and the higher end talents are expensive as all get out, but it's not as bad as Deathwatch where you lean so heavily on gear and your implants because you're so utterly worthless otherwise. That said, you'll still be the squishiest out of the DH-RT-DW-OW combo, so plan accordingly.
In terms of game play, teamwork is a lot more important. Due to the aptitudes of each class, a character can, very cheaply, build themselves to do one or two jobs really well, but will be mediocre or even terrible at others, which means the team will have to have a good mix, and support one another well. Couple this with the fact that you're not as durable as Deathwatch characters, and it makes combat a bit more intense. Hordes and elite enemies will almost certainly be the death of the team, unless they learn to use things like cover and overwatch to their advantage. Allied NPCs might be a useful damage buffer until you get a feel for what the party can take. I recommend using nothing heavier than heavy stubbers and mortars at first, since those can be pretty devastating in their own right.
Missions are broadly similar to Deathwatch, except instead of being the the turning point in a battle or assassinating the BBEG, you're doing the gruntwork. You're scouting enemy positions, assaulting bunker lines, air dropping out of valks, and launching amphibious assaults. It's kind of a band of brother feel, but can also be turned into the Dirty Dozen or Kelly's Heroes easily enough. The real choice is are you going to have them be part of a larger NPC unit, or a squad unto themselves, going solo. That will affect the flavor of the missions a lot, but it's easy enough to transition from one style to another.
I prefer OW, but I was never a huge fan of Deathwatch except as one shots.
Reds
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Post by ElegaicRequiem on Jul 31, 2012 22:02:10 GMT -5
Because of the way classes work in OW compared to DH/RT/DW, and to a lesser extent BC, you can now make a character to do X job with maybe 5 or 6K xp as opposed to the 10-20K xp you needed in other systems. This assumes that you're not substituting X for "be Sly Marbo jack-of-all-trades par excellentitude." That said, you're probably only going to have 12-17 wounds for a very long time. Then again, at 6K in the other systems, you probably had fewer than that, anyway.
Between the game changes (Meli mentioned a bunch of them) and the creation rules, OW characters can get a lot more powerful more quickly if they survive.
And seriously, why does my guardsman have the chance to take a talent that is basically the equivalent of hitting each mini in base contact? I think the only person on the table top that does that is a SM chapter master. Lilith doesn't count, since her version is even better.
Meh, I'll find a way to break any system with a bit of work and a little help.
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Post by tagakoner on Aug 1, 2012 4:47:19 GMT -5
Hi, thanks for all the responses.
This all sounds great, that aptitude systems sounds a LOT more streamlined than DW's hundred and one advancement charts.
One question: I heard there was a pilot/driver character. So I assume, if you have a regiment with vehicles, then he pretty much plays as the vehicle? Which sounds quite fun, but how useful is he should he be forced outside the vehicle or the vehicle gets broken?
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Post by ElegaicRequiem on Aug 1, 2012 7:42:32 GMT -5
As useful as any guardsman with a flashlight. Which is actually useful enough, since they can all do FRFSRF without an order...
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Post by RedsandRoyals on Aug 1, 2012 9:45:26 GMT -5
"Operator" is kind of the diet techpriest, it seems. Their ability to handle Tech use to some extent makes them a good choice for a party without a proper coggo, and they can also be played as an int character. Good choice for the squad's vox guy.
Reds
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Post by emptyhat on Aug 1, 2012 10:42:14 GMT -5
Or for demolitions.
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Post by tagakoner on Aug 1, 2012 16:14:42 GMT -5
I like the idea of him becoming demo-expert, is pretty nifty.
i'm sorry, I am not all that familiar with the system, so what do you mean ElegaicRequiem by they get FRFSRF? Do the comrades also fire their lasguns and do damage?
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Post by ElegaicRequiem on Aug 1, 2012 20:28:40 GMT -5
Unlike every other system so far, firing rapid fire is now a half action instead of a full action.
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Post by Melissia on Aug 1, 2012 21:36:11 GMT -5
There's also a talent called Lasgun Barrage that gives bonuses for lasgun firing when you haven't moved that turn.
To be specific, when firing them in full or semi-auto mode, the character gains an automatic additional degree of success as long as they pass. Number of hits when firing in full and semi auto modes are determined by degrees of success-- for full auto, this is basically the same as automatically getting two hits, hwile for semi-auto, this means that you only need one degree of success to get two hits. So not only do you do full or semi twice in one turn, but each time you do so you get a bonus to hit multiple times.
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Post by hacxattack on Oct 9, 2012 12:31:02 GMT -5
"During his turn, a character may perform one Full Action or two different Half Actions... In addition, characters in Only War may only make one Action with the Attack subtype and one action with the Concentration subtype during their turn."
Your argument is invalid. Having S/SA/FA as half-actions only allows you to also aim or move (aiming seems very important in OW). You can't do two attack actions in one turn. It's always been this way in WH40k, from what I can recall.
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Post by Melissia on Oct 12, 2012 23:39:53 GMT -5
I've GMed an Only War game since the start of the beta and beyond, still am doing it. Actualy, I've probably played OW the most (both as a player and a GM) out of anyone on this forum. My argument is not invalid While I do houserule that this applies to the same action as well (because it makes more sense that way), even if you stick strictly to the rules, you can still make more than one type of attack in a turn; a full auto and a semi-auto, or semi and standard, for example. As you stated, it says, strictly speaking, "two different half actions". Ergo, with a lasgun, you can choose to aim and semi-auto, or semi-auto and then single fire, if you feel you'll be more likely to get an extra shot that way instead. Or with the autogun, full and then semi.
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Hookah, S.C.
Colonel
Mostly Harmless
25%
But what if I put more plasma on it?
Posts: 390
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Post by Hookah, S.C. on Oct 24, 2012 5:42:13 GMT -5
Hmm. This beta is only the rules. I love reading the fluff of the 40K RP books. Will wait for an orky version.
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