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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Mar 24, 2014 14:51:03 GMT -5
First off, link to the Faeit 212 source: natfka.blogspot.com/2014/03/militarum-tempestus-taurox-and-scion.html?m=1Then, a quick summary of what it's saying: Stormies maintain the same statline and SW availability as in the current 'Dex, with the addition of the "overcharged lasgun" as some sort of SW. Some kind of Stormie Command Squad for an all Storm Trooper FOC. New (arguably ugly) vehicle has 11/10/10, can hold 10 models, can re-roll difficult terrain roles, and comes with an autocannon. The Taurox Prime variant can be equipped with a Battle Cannon, among other goodies. Just doing my duty to the Emperor. -Gunny EDIT: as per title, none of this is confirmed. Interesting, though.
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Post by gamma016 on Mar 24, 2014 17:25:25 GMT -5
I'm thinking a battle cannon for that low of a price is not going to happen, or else the new WAAC lists will run 8-11 of them (or however many you can possibly fit into one FOC, I assumed 2HQ, 6Troops, and possibly 3Elite) it will be like venom spams but much worse.
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Mar 24, 2014 18:13:06 GMT -5
But at such a sucky armor value, and with ordnance not being able to hit flyers in the flyer-heavy sixth, I'm not sure the battle cannon spam would work against some armies. That being said, I am now absolutely going to build a battle cannon spam list as soon as the 'dex is out. So I'm a hypocrite.
-Gunny
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Post by gamma016 on Mar 24, 2014 21:07:40 GMT -5
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Mar 24, 2014 21:30:03 GMT -5
Hang it all! I hate misinformation! Probably for the best, though.
Deep Strike and Move Through Cover are nice to have right off the bat. But for the price of a Tac Squad? Yikes.
-Gunny
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Post by yvain on Mar 25, 2014 8:43:24 GMT -5
Some of the other weapons are interesting, it just seems unlikely that I will be buying that thing. On the plus side, I think the storm troopers look better in these pics. Including the other helmet set! I still like trooper's Stormtroopers the best though. The price is better. I can't wait to use them in my guard
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Mar 25, 2014 12:35:27 GMT -5
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Post by vegna on Mar 25, 2014 14:12:21 GMT -5
well i was right abotu it being a CCS although still think they dont look good, sort of like wanabe spacemarine scouts >.<
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Mar 25, 2014 14:21:02 GMT -5
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Post by yvain on Mar 25, 2014 15:49:40 GMT -5
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Post by dangerrod on Mar 25, 2014 17:47:52 GMT -5
Still not convinced on a majority of these new rules
I'm going to wait til I get my hands on either codex
Up until then, this is still conjecture
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Mar 25, 2014 18:28:09 GMT -5
Hm. I'm as excited as the next guy for Tempestus, but it's a bummer that the Guard codex might be getting pushed back.
Also, Note to Self: buy a HWS while they still come in boxes of three.
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Post by emptyhat on Mar 26, 2014 11:41:54 GMT -5
I guess they'll be selling them as single teams at half the price soon
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Post by yvain on Mar 26, 2014 12:06:02 GMT -5
millests.blogspot.co.uk/2014/03/rules-preview-for-militarium-tempestus.htmlRules leak from white dwarf I am guessing. The first thing I notice is that Stormtroopers are no longer reroll scatter for deep strike. That is a pretty huge nerf. I suppose it makes sense that you can't have a whole army do that. I hope the ones in the Guard book have it still. The short bus seems pretty pricy for something that is so easily destroyed. It is essentially a rhino with a slightly better weapon. No one fears rhinos. I can't really see any reason to take it over a Chimera. The hotshot volly gun can be taken for melta price on Stormtrooper squads. It seems like a pretty great option with its 2/4 Salvo. The 24 inch range means two units of 5 stormies could do some serious damage to MEQs for fairly cheap.
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Post by cheminhaler on Mar 26, 2014 12:13:13 GMT -5
Not normal rhinos, compare it to Blood Angel rhinos. It says 'FAST' in the picture so this sounds more like a trukk than a Chimera, albeit without 'open topped' . If you're making a mech army it might be more worthwhile to spam this monster into some kind of multiple small unit list, simply because it's fast and can get some of your squads to their destination before being blown to smithereens. Personally, though, I'd take the chimera over the Tau-rocks anyday; better armour and it looks better.
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Post by Trickstick on Mar 26, 2014 12:35:59 GMT -5
Move through cover works well in combination with deep strike, I can see a few squads dropping into terrain being worth it. It will be a shame if they lose the spec ops reroll though. I may buy a box of them to make into a command squad for my 30 kasrkins, using them as an ally to my Guard. If they are scoring that will be a pretty big deal, I love the idea of drop STs that can score.
As for the volley gun, I think that I would prefer plasma and melta. Unless there is an order to make a squad relentless, which would boost the power a fair bit.
I was shocked to see the cost of power weapons and fists, as well as plasma pistols. I hope that this is not indicative of the Guard codex.
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Post by yvain on Mar 26, 2014 13:16:02 GMT -5
Coupled with ones of the behind enemy lines ability it would be pretty great. Infiltrating then pinning with two 4-shot at str 4 ap 3 with range 24 would be insane.
Honestly, the special operations rules was the best part about storm troopers. I will be very disappointed if they take it away. Without it they are basically just veterans with a stronger lasgun.
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Post by cheminhaler on Mar 26, 2014 16:34:30 GMT -5
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Post by gamma016 on Mar 26, 2014 19:57:06 GMT -5
I don't know if I'm reading this right or not, but the taurox seems to have two firing points on each side. So in theory you could have four models shooting out of the back of it. I'm personally looking forward to having the scoins as an elite platoon for the guards. This way you can really take a foot slogging army and have something to deal with back field armour. Plus the fact that it's one to three squads of scoins and zero to one command squad gives you lots of flexibility.
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Mar 26, 2014 21:22:02 GMT -5
The inclusion of hotshot lasguns in FrFSrF could be an interesting development. I could almost see Stormies actually do some damage to MeQs that way. My mathhammer seems to figure about 6 wounds for a single round of shooting this way. Not bad at all.
That being said, it's still only 18" range, and it's still only 4+ armor after the smoke clears. :/
-Gunny
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Mar 27, 2014 13:24:25 GMT -5
DOUBLE POST
So, do these photos of the page of White Dwarf confirm the rules, or is this still technically speculation/unconfirmed? Just wondering if I should change the thread title.
Also, I'm super curious to hear what you guys think about the rules for the Taurox and Stormies. I'm not a super competitive gamer, so maybe there's something I'm missing, but it seems like these rules are a little lackluster? They're cool rules, and cool models -- but are they particularly usable outside of fluff-lists? It seems like they (still) don't do anything that other units do better, cheaper, or in-addition to other roles.
@ gamma I actually missed that on my first reading. Four shots coming out of a fast transport for the Guard. Not bad at all. I'm still scared of AV 11/10/10 on my transports. I feel like Chimeras get popped too early as it is.
@ cheminhaler I could see a Taurox spam, perhaps, but it seems like they're too expensive for that. The Fast and Terrain stuff is nice, though, and I wonder if that's enough to make the difference in getting shootas-in-range for the guard army (meltas, plasma, demos, krak grenades) before the Taurox gets popped.
@ Trickstick Yeah, those Special Ops rules really make the day for me. Helps the rules and the fluff. Hopefully they get something else that we haven't seen yet to give them that edge again.
-Gunny
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Post by dangerrod on Mar 27, 2014 14:55:17 GMT -5
I managed to sweet talk a manager here into giving me a copy of next weeks WD
Having had a look at the rules the Taurox seems a little disappointing, 50pts is ok, but that paper thin armour is worrying. Any unit in the current guard dex can take one if they can take a chimera
The Taurox Prime seems ok at 80pts, it does have BS4 and two weapon systems. Either a t/l autocannon or a t/l hot shot volley gun mounted to the chassis or the turret mounted battle cannon, t/l Gatling cannon or the missile launcher. The ideal use for me would be to move this 24" first turn and if it survives a turn of shooting support the troops it's disembarked. Can be taken by any tempestus unit only. Again though the armour is worrying!
The silly thing about both versions is that they can both be given dozer blades! Yet they both have an all terrain APC Rules which already allow them to re roll failed dangerous terrain tests!
The actual tempestus units seem ok, with deep strike and move through cover they should survive a deep strike. The biggest change is that they've dropped to the same point cost as the current veterans!! That's big!! This gives us a good indication that the price of troops in the future dex had dropped.
The tempestus command squad is where you can do some real damage for 85pts base, you can give them four special weapons to get some real deep striking death! Along with the tempest or Prime who can issue orders (at this stage as per the current platoon command squad, but they hint at their being more orders to come in the future dex)
Looking good so far
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Mar 27, 2014 20:07:50 GMT -5
@ dangerrod Awesome that you got a chance to look at the WD 'dex! I totally agree with your sentiment about the flimsy Taurox armor. But about the Scions -- they're the same price as veterans, but half the size, no? 5-man squads, I thought, which makes them a bit pricey for me. That being said, the deepstriking Command Squad with meltas could be really nice for guard.
-Gunny
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Post by dangerrod on Mar 27, 2014 22:14:18 GMT -5
Yeah, the same points but only half the size
Can be upgraded to units of 10 though
Your really paying for the deep strike and move through cover USR along with the increased BS
Squad size if storm troopers has always been low compared to vets and infantry squads. The issue here is that they've dropped by 15pts compared to the last dex which should indicate that the vets point cost should also drop (that is, if the vets actually make it to the codex)
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Mar 27, 2014 22:33:59 GMT -5
I do hope Vets make it into the new dex! I would really have to adjust my army if they don't.
-Gunny
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