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Post by Trooper One-Nine-Seven-Four on Apr 5, 2014 13:37:07 GMT -5
Ohh... Just looked through the new WD more comprehensively and sexy, sexy! We'll be having rules for Tank Commanders--which essentially allows you to have your Warlord be mounted up in a tank, and they will be getting their own set of special orders to issue.
Gotta say that I'm starting to look forward to the upcoming codex.
Oh, and the Wyvern is equipped with 2 sets of the mortar system, and the mortars in each set are TL, so you get to re-roll scatter on the barrage, and they get to re-roll to wound from shred, and they also ignore cover. Sounds like the Wyvern is going to be the answer to hordes of Orks and 'Nids, and can also be used to snipe characters, special, and heavy weapon bearers since you can center the barrage on such models.
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Post by yvain on Apr 5, 2014 15:23:59 GMT -5
I don't think it sounds bad. It is like a poor mans Thunderfire cannon. The ignore cover is kind of negated by the low AP, but the shred is nice. A pair of them will destroy nids, orks, Guard, and Tau. I think however it will be most useful supporting a Basilisk. Like the griffon before acting as the lead hit in the multi barrage.
What is really nice is that Tank HQ. It means you can free up a heavy support slot, which has always been huge for us. I hope nothing else is nerfed.
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Post by yvain on Apr 5, 2014 18:40:02 GMT -5
natfka.blogspot.com/2014/04/astra-militarum-rules-pask-bullgryns.htmlMore rumors up from a translated Italian version, pretty much goes along with previous rumors. Orders repeated from last rumor and it lists what is essentially bring it down, fire on my target, and get back in the fight as usable by ancient officers. I assume that means senior officers. Warlord traits actually all sound pretty great. Pask has some great tank upgrades added in now. Sounds like he would be pretty great if these are true and points aren't too crazy. Apparently Ogryns are nerfed losing FC and Stubborn with same points. Bullgryns have AV +4 for a few more points and can take a power maul and brute shield (what ever that is). WHY? The models look decent now, but the rules are so bad is ridiculous. They must really believe they are TEQ. I guess they don't want to sell any of these.
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Post by Trooper One-Nine-Seven-Four on Apr 5, 2014 19:10:46 GMT -5
Yeah, I was thinking about getting the rest of my 30 metal Orgyns from 2nd edition painted up, but if they are going to lose everything that made them semi-decent, I may not even bother. And I hate the way the Bullgryns look...
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Post by yvain on Apr 5, 2014 20:13:36 GMT -5
Rumors apparently come from this Italian site. I don't know Italian. astropate.blogspot.it/2014/04/nuova-astra-militarum-foto-del-codex-e.htmlTo sum up what I can read: Valkyrie is up 25 points with Lascannon down 5 points. Rocket Pods are down 20 points. Heavy Bolter upgrade is up 10 points. No more searchlights Vendetta is as rumored with no searchlight. Leman Russ are the same with the same cost. You can appoint a tank as an HQ and he can be a general. He gets the tank orders and BS 4, dies if vehicle dies and can't get out. Ratlings are in and are the same cost.
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Post by yvain on Apr 5, 2014 20:27:18 GMT -5
I saw a post saying the Itunes preview has some more spoilers. You can see an options screen for the built in army builder:
Chimera up 10 points - Searchlight 1pt now, Smoke Launchers 5pt, Something called Fire Barrels is 10 points. Thanks for the nerfs!
ML same plus 10 for Flakk Plasma Pistol up 5 Power Weapon up 5 Guardsmen Squad is same price Boltgun on Sgt for 1 pt
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Post by vegna on Apr 5, 2014 20:43:49 GMT -5
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Post by RedsandRoyals on Apr 5, 2014 21:01:10 GMT -5
Actually, it's a re-release. They had a limited run of it before, when the new chimera kit came out if I recall.
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Apr 5, 2014 23:16:34 GMT -5
I'm concerned that all of these rumors seem to be trending towards point-inflation and non-useful units. I like the idea of the Wyvren as much as the next guy, but the current meta favors heavies, monstrous creatures, and vehicles/walkers. An infantry-killer isn't great in a non-infantry-centric game. And what's more, our Golden Child anti-tank unit (Vendetta) is taking a huge point hike. Militarum Tempestus is hardly competitive apart from the Taurox Spam, so that's a strategic flash-in-the-pan.
Pros? Tank-heavy lists just got a bit better -- and russess didnt get slapped with point inflation. Fill up those Heavy Support and HQ slots and drop pies, I suppose.
Not trying to be cynical, but I would love to here y'all's thoughts or counter-arguments about Guard competitiveness based off these rumors?
-Gunny
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Post by yvain on Apr 5, 2014 23:35:38 GMT -5
The thing is Guard has always been powerful and some of these nerfs are necessary. Though it does feel like a lot of nerfs right now. It is still too early to tell. You don't know what upgrades go where or what you can really take.
Stormtroopers losing special operations is a HUGE nerf in my opinion, but they did gain some good things and a point drop. Orders sounds better. Opening up a new HS slot by putting in tank commander sounds great. We need the full price list as well.
I don't like disappearing units. And I feel like right now the book is not adding much, but I think we will come out more or less the same as before.
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Apr 5, 2014 23:59:12 GMT -5
The disappearing units are a sad sight indeed. It's a simple case of copy/paste.
I'd rather have an old unit with old fluff and a points hike rather than no unit at all.
-Gunny
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Post by yarrick22 on Apr 6, 2014 9:48:07 GMT -5
Maybe this is a dumb question, but I keep seeing the Militarum Tempestus codex being referred to as a mini-dex, implying it is for storm troopers only. However, based on the posts above as well as the 104 page count, it appears to me that this is the new IG codex. If it indeed is the codex, why was the name changed from Imperial Guard to Militarum Tempestus? Was this referenced in one of the IG novels (note, I haven't read them)? Also, why has the entire IG section been wiped from the GW website?
~yarrick22
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Post by Trickstick on Apr 6, 2014 10:11:08 GMT -5
Militarum Tempestus contains the rules for Scions (Storm Troopers) and a few support units, such as Valkyrie, Taurox and Commissars. It is pretty much a mini-dex as it doesn't even have heavy support or elites. The replacement for IG is coming out next weekend, which is the Astra Militarum codex.
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Post by Comrade on Apr 6, 2014 11:25:55 GMT -5
What I've gathered from some italian blog, guy has pics of the codex, but wont put them all up due to worrying about being shut down, but he is answering some questions in the comments section.
*Chim is 10 pts more expensive, no smoke, no light *Ogryns are 40 ppm *Valk 125 pts *Vend 170 pts (capacity 6) *Armoured sent is 40pts (10 pts for plasma or lascannon)
*combined squads are still there *scions are in the dex in some form *Veterans may be in platoon organization chart in some form like conscripts * decrease cost of vets by 10 pts *conscripts still exist *Special weapon squads are still in the dex *Leman russes are cheaper, HQ upgrade is 30 pts
*one of the ogryn shields gives a 5++ while another is a mobile cover save.
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Post by Trooper One-Nine-Seven-Four on Apr 6, 2014 13:07:22 GMT -5
Ohh... The idea of a Veteran platoon is interesting.
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Post by Comrade on Apr 6, 2014 13:24:51 GMT -5
Ohh... The idea of a Veteran platoon is interesting. I got a more of a : You have to buy a basic platoon before you can have a veteran squad tax sort of thing.
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Apr 6, 2014 13:27:37 GMT -5
The idea of a veteran platoon is very appealing. That being said, if they can't be taken as individual squads (apart from platoon organization) that means the cost of our barebones HQ and Troop choices just went up. 140 points for two Troops is very different from 260 points for two Troops. Trade-offs, I suppose.
Just using the points-rumors above and assuming infantry squads and PCS stay the same in points, you could build the following in a 2k double-FOC:
HQ -2x Tank Commander in basic Russ
TROOPS -4x bare-bones platoon
HEAVY SUPPORT -8x Leman Russ (some two-model squadrons required)
And you'd still have extra points to screw around with to upgrade the infantry to sit on objectives or the Russes to a different variant. Purely theoretical, and might get rolled by a flyer heavy force, but interesting none-the-less. 10 LRBT are nothing to spit at.
-Gunny
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Post by Trooper One-Nine-Seven-Four on Apr 6, 2014 14:26:06 GMT -5
I've got enough minis converted up, or in process of being converted (in my version of carapace for 'Chans) to comprise a Veteran platoon, assuming that the number of troopers required hasn't changed, along with two platoon's worth of regular troopers, so I'm not fussed about having to take a regular platoon as a "tax" to unlock a Veteran platoon. Ideally we'll still be able to take them as individual squads, but if not well then that's how things fall.
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Post by Comrade on Apr 6, 2014 16:11:52 GMT -5
I was thinking more like ( Platoon consists of 1 PCS, 2-5 squads, 0-1 conscripts 0-1 veterans)
Not trying to rain on your parade trooper.
Also according to Natfka:
*Vets are now limited to 2 special weapons -Vet doctrines: Grenadiers : 15 pts Scouts (come w/ camo and mines) 10pts Demo (?? points)
*Commissars can be assigned to any unit in the book
*Manitcore is +10 points *Basilisk is staying the same. *Same with the Deathstrike
*Priests - 25 pts
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Post by AshotNINJA on Apr 6, 2014 16:23:32 GMT -5
that annoys me very much... only 2 special weapons per vet squad... my converted squads will be ruined!
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Post by gamma016 on Apr 6, 2014 16:35:53 GMT -5
Yeah, if that's true about only two special weapons I'm not sure if plasma vets will be worth it any more. With three of them in a chimera now I'm losing 1-2 a turn from gets hot.
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Post by Gunny O'Grady on Apr 6, 2014 16:51:29 GMT -5
Vets as a 0-1 choice in a platoon would be crappy. Crappy, indeed.
-Gunny
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Post by Trooper One-Nine-Seven-Four on Apr 6, 2014 18:29:57 GMT -5
Ah got it. So not their own platoon, but an add on like special weapon squads, conscripts, and HW squads are currently...
I don't know how to feel about Vets having only 2 special weapons per squad. I would likely drive me to start in on building more carapace 'Chans in order to spread out my now superfluous special weapons...
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Post by yarrick22 on Apr 6, 2014 19:35:47 GMT -5
Militarum Tempestus contains the rules for Scions (Storm Troopers) and a few support units, such as Valkyrie, Taurox and Commissars. It is pretty much a mini-dex as it doesn't even have heavy support or elites. The replacement for IG is coming out next weekend, which is the Astra Militarum codex. Thanks for the clarification trickstick, I was very confused. ~Yarrick22
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Post by Comrade on Apr 6, 2014 21:48:42 GMT -5
*Conscripts -60 pts for 20, 3ppm after that *Hvy weapon squads -45 base, same cost for upgrades as current
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