Need Help With Army List

[jd6809]

Hello everyone!



I am new to IGMB, and need some help with my Imperial Guard army.


In my local hobby center the most common army is space marines which my army really struggles with (won 20% of all games).

Any advice or comments would be helpful on how to build an effective army.

My army is as follows:

- 1 company command squad
- 4 ten man infantry squads
- 1 heavy weapons team 
- 1 sentinal


Cheers!

[rpython]

What are your guardsmen equipped with? what heavy weapon as well?

[rpython]

What are your guardsmen equipped with? what heavy weapon as well?

[yvain]

Hey man welcome,

Unfortunately, everything has changed in the past day or so with the new book dropping. With your army being that small, I am assuming you are usually playing at around 500 points. A few more details would help. Drop your full army list and current point level you usually play at in the army list section of the board. In addition, are you facing bikes, drop pods, foot slogging, or just rhino borne Marines?

Until then here is some general advice to get you started:

1. Keep things cheap, it is usually better to take two of something than 1 expensive upgraded unit.
2. Make tasks for your units and the fill out special weapons to fit. Don't put a mortar, Missile launcher, heavy bolter on a HWT squad. Better to tailor a bunch of units to a specific role. Look at weapons that have the same profile. A sniper matches a heavy bolter because they are both heavy, have the same range, and would generally fire at the same targets. A melta and a lascannon would not because whille they are both for tank hunting, one is a short range assault weapon, the other is a long range heavy weapon. Every time you fire one of those wastes its short.
3. Most upgrades are bad without a specific goal. If you put every up grade on one unit chances are they will only come into play once. And if they die again it is points wasted. Generally it is better to keep things naked, sometimes how things come in handy.
4. Long Range fire power is your main advantage. The new books have lots of cheap tanks and artillery guns that can really punish your opponent turn one. Look into that.
5. When in doubt more men. This is the only one that has always been universal. Lasguns while weak are very effective on mass.

[jd6809]

This is my usual army list I play at my local hobby store:

*note*
The list may be out of date so go easy on me

HQ

CCS:
- Company commander w. power sword and plasma pistol
- Medic
- Regimental Standard
- Vox Caster
- Guardsman w. plasma gun
- Bodyguard w. power sword
- Astropath

Elites:

Ratlings:
-Base

Storm troopers
- Sergeant w. power sword
- Storm trooper w. hotshot lasgun x 4

Troops:

Platoon 1:

PCS:
- Commander w. Powerfist
- Medic
- Vox caster
- Guardsman w. meltagun
- Guardsman w. lasgun

Squad 1:
- Sergeant w. close-combat weapon
- Vox caster
- Guardsman w. grenade launcher x 2
- Guardsman w. lasgun x 6

Squad 2:
- Sergeant w. close-combat weapon
- Vox caster
- Guardsman w. flamer
- Guardsman w. H-flamer
- Guardsman w. lasgun x 6

Squad 3:
- Seargent w. close-combat weapon
- Vox caster
- Guardsman w. grenade launcher x 2
- Guardsman w. lasgun x 6

Veteran Squad:
- Sergeant w. lasgun
- Vox caster
- Guardsman w. lasgun x 2
- Lascannon team x 3

Fast attack:
- Scout Sentinel w. Auto cannon

The space marine opponents are basically the assult on black reach with the addition of a rhino and predator and special characters i.e Marneus Calgar

[yvain]

Your list isn't legal even in the old rules, but no worries.

You can't take a heavy flamer on regular infantry squads and they only are allowed one special weapon. Bodyguard can't take special weapons, but they are gone now so it doesn't matter. Veterans can only take 3 special weapons not 3 weapon teams. In addition, looking at your list a few of these choices are no ideal, however this is changing now with the new book. This looks like 750 points if I am not mistaken.

A couple more tips right off the bat. In general, power weapons on guard are not a good idea because we have INT 3 and low armor. Because of the way challeges work, it is likely that we will get a wound before having a chance to strike. It basically becomes points down the drain. If you take them you you almost have to build a unit around them and power axes are mostly the way to go. Right now they work best in a combined squad with power axes and one naked sgt to absorb the challenge. Then the rest of your sgts munch on their enemies and because they are INT 3 the unwieldy trait doesn't matter. Guard are never going to be good at CC and they also go more expensive in the new book so this is more important than ever. PF are now 2.5 ratlings and PW are 1.5. This kind of makes the fist pointless except on commissars. Vox casters in the past have been not very good. Orders have been improved, but the truth is you may pass the order even without the caster so why pay so much for each of them? It adds up, but that is for you do decide. Voxes are great in combined squads because you only need 2.

There are some new key units to look at with the new book. Primaris psykers are cheaper and have access to the all important divination tree. Priests confer fearless and close combat ability for cheap. In fact, for the same price as a new power fist, a priest can make a smash attack at INT 3 on a leadership test, which would have the same profile as a fist. He also has a 4++ invul and grants fearless and hatred to the squad. This is better than an individual powerfist in every way. Commissars are pretty cheap now and can take power weapons with a higher WS so they are a decent choice as well.

Grenade Launchers are a rough choice. Statstically, they will do less damage than a lasgun. However, they do have the potential to damage light vehicles and one shot 4+ armor. Heavy Flamers got way cheaper and are a good choice now, but they only go on Veterans or PCS.

While your lascannon Vet squad would be ideal it is not legal so you have to shift around a bit. HWS are kind of overpriced. However, since you have so little anti tank you will probably need to take one. They are usually best hidden in an IS. You could also use some transports or some artillery. Transports give you mobility and a pillbox to shoot from. The Wyvern just lets you effect his units for keep while your infantry foot slog forward. Let me rework your list into something that a fits the new book.

[yvain]

CCS with Lascannon, Medic, MOO

Ratlings x 3

Stormtroopers with 2 melta

PCS - HF, vox, flamer x2, Priest

Inf Squad with GL and vox

Inf Squad with GL and vox

Inf Squad with GL and vox

HWS with 3x lascannon

Veterans with Plasma Gun x 2 and Carapace

Scout Sent with AC

This build only changes a few of your models and restructures the responsibilities. Your CC remains in the back field with the 3 weapon teams to give them orders. New bring it down gives tank hunter which is pretty solid. In addition, he has his own Lascannon which is BS 4 and an MOO which is a 20 point earthshaker round. Since he is camping in the back there is no need for him to ever move getting that shot off as much as possible. So you have 3 lascannon shots that reroll their penetrate rolls from the HWS. Then you have an addition BS 4 shot from the CCS and the Earthshaker shot, which if it hits rolls 2 dice and picks the highest while also rerolling because of bring it down.

Your grunts move forward with the Veterans in the back to guard those plasma guns. The rhinos should mostly charge you. So you should be in range by turn 2. Those plasma guns will make short work of any marines they see. Use the new Take Aim order to eliminate any special weapons like flamers and heavy bolters that will shred your guardsmen. Taking out the Sergeant if he has a power weapon is a good idea too. Mass your IS onto one target. and try to weaken threat before they charge you. If he does charge you, eat it with an infantry squad. Then wait until the fight is over. Once it is, hit them with the flamers on the PCS and then counter charge. Absorb the challenge with the platoon commander and let the priest go to town on the remaining marines. (unless he has a fist or ax in that case use the priest to beat him at his own game )

Scout Sent outflanks to try to get any rear armor shots or nice targets in the back field. A dreadnoughts and predators have 10 in the back which would make an easy target for the Sent. Same deal with the stormtroopers. We lost special operations, which is a big nerf. However, a safe deep strike should be able to get you in melta range within a turn.

[jd6809]

Thanks for the help mate

[yvain]

No worries, you should invest in some transports probably. If you go ground, 2 chimeras and a short bus will do. If you prefer air, get at least one Vendetta and a Valkyrie. Primaris Psykers are now awesome and one is probably a must include for the cheap divination powers. Then grab some tanks.

[jd6809]

Ok i'll look into that!

As a quick question would this army also work against foot slogging marines?

[yvain]

Apr 14, 2014 7:03:22 GMT -5 jd6809 said:

Ok i'll look into that!

As a quick question would this army also work against foot slogging marines?

Well yes and no. You sound new to the game. (not trying to insult you or anything) The internet will have you believe that list building is the 90% of this game, when really its only like 30-40%. If you walk into a game with a completely bonkers list you are of course setting yourself up for failure, but an average or below average list well played should almost always win against a great list that is poorly utilized. (minus some of the spamming exploit lists that are almost auto win)

The other 40-50% is target priority, maneuver, and deployment, probably in that order. Knowing what to shoot first, IE your biggest threats, is huge! Getting your units to the right place to exploit weak point is as well.

The last 10-20% is just luck. Some times you get dice screwed on key rolls. Nothing you can do against that.

The list I posted should do fine against pretty much anything someone throws at that point level excluding a completely tailored list. You could probably make a more tailored list, but one that is kind of cheesy in the sense you shouldn't know exactly what your opponent has before hand and two if he brings something different you could screw yourself.

A footslogging marine army is likely to include at least one thunderfire cannon, which eats guardsmen. If he brings more than one he is probably power gaming you. So having a few snipers to take that out early on will prevent a lot of heartache.

Your stormtroopers will shred marine infantry. So will that master of ordanance barrage if it hits. (it is inaccurate so make sure to pick a good target) Those are instant kill marine troops. Same with the plasma on the Veterans. Those will end a marine players day quickly. So make sure to protect those units.

Anything big should eat it to the lascannon team. Especially a predator or a dreadnought. 50% should hit and with the tank hunter rule granted by the bring it down order, should get penetrates at the very least reducing their effectiveness.

Keep your infantry squads separate in case he tries to charge you. He will eat up a turn munching on the doomed guardsmen and then you PCS is set up behind to flame the victors.

I don't want to say you will win, but you should be fully capable of doing so with that list.

[jd6809]

Ok thanks for all your help