|
Post by cheminhaler on May 7, 2014 14:05:13 GMT -5
I like the idea of an "unbound" list, since it might offer the opportunity to field all sorts of themed armies that simply don't fit into the FOC (and I'm not building them just on the off chance I might be able to waste an entire day on an Apocalypse game): - Rough Rider army (Borderers, based on Brettonian squires) - Scout or Reserve Marine company (including the options to mount them all on bikes or land speeders) Both of those are great ideas. I can do the rough rider one without spending at all but the marine one will cost me around £260 just for 13 more landspeeders. Maybe I'll just start getting them slowly. For a proper rough rider list, though, I'd prefer to have a mounted ccs that could issue special rough rider orders and be able to take mounted commissars and primaris psykers. Psykers might freak the horses out but I don't see why not. however, I feel it puts more emphasis on the players organising a game to define what they want between them. Thats how I feel. Like how I want to make 2 devastator squads with 8 heavy bolters only to fight ork infantry hordes or guard hordes, it'd be like making a request for someone to bring X and you'll bring Y.
|
|
|
Post by treadiculous on May 7, 2014 17:33:20 GMT -5
I like this idea (^^).. I have around 300 orks and about 100 ork nobs
you get 16 heavy bolters and 48" of panic
I think your guys should be relentless too.. that'd give you an extra 24" of brown trousers!
|
|
|
Post by jenburdoo on May 7, 2014 20:20:55 GMT -5
I agree with Treadiculous. It's not gonna be just low-points Apoc (though I wouldn't mind that). It may not be as balanced as anyone may like, but it's not going to be as simple as it looks either.
"The situation is never as bad (or as good) as first reports indicate." -- Field Marshal Bill Slim
|
|
|
Post by sunshine on May 8, 2014 0:16:59 GMT -5
I actually doubt it would be a spamfest of ten flyrants or ten riptides. Such a one dimensional list is what the better tournament players would expect people to bring, and would hence plan their cleverer, more thought out lists to counter.
|
|
|
Post by glutebite on May 8, 2014 12:18:54 GMT -5
640 Conscripts (1 blob), 1 Priest, 1 Psyker (Prescience) - for a 2000 pt army
I deploy first (assume dawn of war deployment)
1 row of conscripts at 2" apart = 36 models 642 models / 36 models per row = 17.8 rows of models (round up to 18 rows)
Deployment zone is 12" - so I can get 12 rows deployed (432 models) and then will have to mash the rest together to get all 642 models on the table.
Turn 1: Move 6" and start shooting at anything. Probably won't do a dang bit of good
By Turn 6: Guard has probably lost 50% of their models (320 models). I'm still here probably spaced out across the table but still within coherency. Will probably never get 6 turns in because it will take me 1 hr per turn to move and shoot.
Point of exercise: I've got carpel tunnel in my wrists from painting and moving models all over the table. I'm gonna sue GW for duress. My opponent hates me to the point of just wanting to physically puke. I'll never get a sportsmanship award. I'll be banned from the Imperium.
|
|
|
Post by jenburdoo on May 8, 2014 19:29:01 GMT -5
Can't have one blob. They still have to have normal unit selection.
You could still have 16 blobs of 40 conscripts.
|
|
|
Post by Trooper One-Nine-Seven-Four on May 8, 2014 21:39:36 GMT -5
Heh. And even if they were a single blob, what happens if you take 25% casualties in one turn (and the Priest bites it too just to remove any whatever he might give to modify their morale... I don't remember if he does or not), they fail their Ld and run off the table (since the rear rank would likely be near or at the table edge)? 16 blobs of 40 conscripts, though, now that would be a sight to behold, and I'd even let you use Chenkov from the previous codex and "Send in the next wave!" Because it would be cool.
|
|
|
Post by gamma016 on May 9, 2014 4:36:41 GMT -5
Throw in Yarrick and you will never have to worry about losing 25%
|
|
|
Post by Rolling Thunder on May 9, 2014 4:44:20 GMT -5
One awful set of rules replaces another.
|
|
|
Post by ElegaicRequiem on May 9, 2014 10:22:52 GMT -5
Those blobs would be way too much fun to hit with a hellhound list.
|
|
|
Post by cheminhaler on May 9, 2014 14:23:55 GMT -5
It would literally be barbecue night in the forest.
|
|
|
Post by ElegaicRequiem on May 9, 2014 15:14:14 GMT -5
We're talking about conscripts, not furry woodland creatures. Why a forest?
|
|
|
Post by yvain on May 11, 2014 9:23:51 GMT -5
New rumor drop. The book is supposed to be available for pre-order on the 17th. Some of this stuff seems plausible and rumors are going to be getting more reliable the closer we get.
1. 4ed consolidate in to combat is in 2. If you fail to cast a power you can't cast it the rest of the game 3. Every unit including vehicles will now score 4. Unbound armies may not contest objectives 5. Lords of war are in 6. Escalation and stronghold remain as they are now 7. Vehicles will be harder to kill the chart changes once more. 8. The book will come out in 3 options Art like warhammer visions, Fluff book, and one that only contains rules and that one is about as think as the current SM book. 9.difficult terrain is just -2 inches 10. Wound allocation has changed a bit.not super clear as to how. 11. D-weapons toned down but he was unclear as what that meant so from the sounds of it they will still be super ugly
Number 4: Is not enough. Hopefully there is more to it. Against the spam army, you wouldn't survive to claim any objectives of your own.
|
|
|
Post by cheminhaler on May 11, 2014 9:51:13 GMT -5
We're talking about conscripts, not furry woodland creatures. Why a forest? Wargames are more often set in a forest, rather than a barracks.
|
|
|
Post by jenburdoo on May 11, 2014 12:26:24 GMT -5
I don't like the consolidating-into-combat thing. Never did.
|
|
|
Post by yvain on May 12, 2014 6:12:26 GMT -5
GW posted a video briefly talking about the new army types. It shows some images of the rulebook. Looks like the bonus for core army is........re-roll warlord trait. www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JnMByJVUow&feature=youtu.beIt could be inferred from some of the wording that there are more types of bound armies rules. But seriously LOL! It does also look like unbound might not have access to allies, just formations. However, that is hardly a nerf at all. Hopefully, there is more. First reddit comment: That will be comforting as 10 riptides pummel you into the ground.
|
|
|
Post by Trooper One-Nine-Seven-Four on May 12, 2014 13:38:32 GMT -5
Jervis just doesn't look the same without the mullet and sunglasses that he used to rock in the Rogue Trader and 2nd edition eras///
|
|
|
Post by yvain on May 13, 2014 17:14:21 GMT -5
New Confirmed in white dwarf Changes:
FMC only take one grounding check a shooting phase in addition they have to be wounded.
D - weapons you get invul saves unless the d weapon rolls 6 to wound.
In a challenge, any wounds dealt passed the kill limit of your opponent carry over into the rest of the models in combat.
Psy changes are as already rumored, gen powers at turn start. Roll for power use, then roll 4+ to cast for each mastery. If you roll 2 6s in the attempt perils. Every army even if they don't have psykers can generate power points to defend against powers on a 6+
|
|
|
Post by Rolling Thunder on May 14, 2014 8:06:01 GMT -5
God I miss 5th
|
|
|
Post by dougeye on May 14, 2014 11:45:09 GMT -5
anyone else notice the models with invulnerable saves normally are sold in smaller quantities at a high price? will be more chaos units with mark of tzeentch (think its that one) giving the models invun saves.
|
|
|
Post by treadiculous on May 14, 2014 17:43:22 GMT -5
why must it always be more complicated...?
I hate rolling more f***ing dice than needed!
just let me plan, make manouveres, consider options and have a games mechanic that is straightforward.
[that means no exceptions to the rule on a roll of x]
[and do we really need to roll for the hit, the wound, the save.. can't we just roll the hit and be done with it? - ergo I shot that model with a f***ing lascannon : its dead...and yeah, the lasguns don't hurt so the chances of killing blow are much less.. lets factor that in to the percentages and make it hard to kill stuff with lasguns]
I can't wait until we can attach a sim card to each models base, then we'll just scan the table with a mobile app which calculates the damage for us.
that would leave us players loads more time for gaming and eliminate the need to study the website, dataslate, rulebook, most recent white dwarf, errata, FAQ and forgeworld just so we can enjoy a tabletop skirmish game... which currently feels like a table top covered in books and dice where the models are lost beneath the pages of rules and only the spires of the tallest building terrain are visible. (probably why flyers and giant models are popular amongst the designer team)
[rant over]
[for now]
|
|
|
Post by cheminhaler on May 15, 2014 15:52:10 GMT -5
The thing is; if you take a lascannon shot to the knee you could survive and hop your way across the table to avenge your fallen kneecap.
|
|
|
Post by jenburdoo on May 19, 2014 18:41:14 GMT -5
Treadiculous:
I'm currently reading a Donald Featherstone ruleset from the '70s for WWII cityfighting. It's 8 pages long in a Kindle app, and since I have no tanks or artillery I can drop half of that and still experiment with the game. There's simply a "to-hit" roll which is modified by range and cover, nothing more. Infantry move is 6", 4" in rubble, and to enter something you move adjacent then enter next move. For morale, a unit down to 50% simply can't move, unless it's in the open in which case it falls back towards cover. And so on. It's very obvious it was early days still for miniatures gaming, but it looks fun and I want to try it.
|
|
|
Post by treadiculous on May 20, 2014 2:25:08 GMT -5
this ruleset sounds interesting... I will have to have a look for it.
thanks for the tip!
|
|
|
Post by Empirespy on May 21, 2014 15:37:28 GMT -5
The thing is; if you take a lascannon shot to the knee you could survive and hop your way across the table to avenge your fallen kneecap. I used to be a guardsman like you, then I took a lascannon to the knee... Sorry I couldn't resist...
|
|