First big game since 4th.

[krieg]

Hey guys, been getting back into the hobby again after a long time away (4th ed), and decided to continue with my Guardsmen. Been playing a few smaller 500pt games and the new orders system is great, but I do miss the old doctrines.  Anyway, I have a game coming up of 2000pts against Chaos and I have a couple of lists worked out but just wanted some second opinions. I will be facing;
a Terminator Lord
a Sorcerer
5 Terminators in a Land Raider
Helbrute
X2 10 CSM in a Rhino
5 Bikes
5 Warptalons
1 Predator
1 Forgefiend.

My first list idea is;
CCS
LR Tank Commander in Executioner with Exterminator wingman
X2 PCS and 30 Guardsmen
X5 HWS X2Mortar squads, Missile Launcher squad, Lascannon squad, 2HB 1Autocannon squad
SWS 3 Meltaguns
Leman Russ Demolisher
Leman Russ
+upgrades

My second list;
Tank Commander in Executioner with Pask upgrade and Exterminator
Tank Commander in Vanquisher with Vanquisher
X2 PCS and 20 Guardsmen
HWS Lascannons
HWS Missile Launchers
Devildog
Leman Russ Demolisher
X3 Leman Russ
Basilisk
+upgrades

I prefer the second list, but that's because I'm a tread head. Tactics-wise I am planning to target the Bikes, Warptalons and Rhinos first, Predator, Helbrute and Forgefiend second, the Land Raiders priority depending on how its used will vary, infantry are a final target.

Thanks for reading.



Krieg

[yvain]

Are you playing 6th or 7th? Using new mission types or old ones? That is important to your strat.

From glancing quick at your lists. Here are some comments that are universal.

HWS are pretty weak and easily killed. Mortars are not very good and are down right terrible now that the Wyvern exists (seriously get one they are awesome). Missile squads are bad as well because of the changes to the damage table. Heavy Bolters always suck compared to autocannons. You need a ton of AC now to deal with transport spam.

You have no transports. It is always rough to foot mobile your guys like that. Especially with short range weapons like melta guns. Transports are pretty crucial beccause they now score along with the troops inside. The chimera is still pretty solid.

Nearly the all the upgrades except for the camo nets are crappy on tanks (maybe storm boler or stubber). Camo nets are pretty sweet now and should be almost a must take on your tanks. With both planne lists, switch the TC with the buddy tank. In the first one, the Commander benefits the exterminator better because of his ballistic skill. In the second, pask will make the exterminator rending (note you should take a punisher with pask instead) and the executioner will benefit from preferred enemy.

Devil Dog is kind of bad. It is too expensive for what it brings. The one saving grace is that it is now a fast objective grabber.

I prefer the second list. Without the transports it will be hard for you to use those infantry effectively. In addition, all the AV 14 will be tough for him to handle and you can be turn one curb stomping a bunch of his key units.

You target priority depends on what era of game you are playing. If in 7th, kill his rhinos, warp talon, bikes, and land raider (at least immobilize) first. Mobility is now key to be flexible with objective grabbing. With your fire power, you should be able to accomplish that easily. Walking with all thsoe slow units he will have a tough time dealing with objectives, which is also your weakness. Then its predator and forge fiend followed by the troops.

[Julian Sharps]

Also consider that in 7th edition, you have the option of ignoring the FOC entirely and using an unbound list composed of whatever models you want. I think it would be amusing to see the look on an opponent's face when you deploy more than a dozen Russes on the table in a 2000-point game.

[jenburdoo]

It's actually possible to do a lot of scary things while NOT ignoring the FOC, because you can have an unlimited number of FOCs now and can also ally with yourself. As long as you include three veteran squads, for example, you could have eighteen tanks in a single FOC by taking an ally. That would be quite close to 3000 points anyway, so there's not much point, but it's something to keep in mind.

[krieg]

Ah thanks guys. We'll be playing 7th, first game. I've not included any transports because of what happened with our little games and the fact that most of his heavy weapons are lascannons, can still kill the Chimera but he has to grind away at a Guardsman squad. In both little games I ended up advancing up the table at him once the main threats were dealt with and using 'First rank fire...' to take out stragglers. And even drawing bayonets to pincushion the last few CSMs. They don't like it up 'em...






Krieg