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Post by cheminhaler on Oct 10, 2014 9:50:55 GMT -5
Hello.
While speaking to Empty the other day I had a brainwave for a pure assault marine army backed up by drop pods holding tactical marines with meltaguns/ multimeltas.
It needs some tweaking but I think this could make an excellent army for fighting guard gunlines.
Thoughts?
SM - 1500 points (IF chapter tactics ; although RG would have been better)
HQ
SM captain - jump pack, grav pistol, boltpistol
Troops
10 Tactical marines, power fist, meltagun, multimelta
Drop pod - deathwind
Troops
10 Tactical marines, plasma pistol, meltagun, multimelta
Drop pod
Troops
5 Tactical marines, grav pistol, meltagun
Drop pod
Troops
5 Tactical marines, thunder hammer, melta bombs, grav gun
Drop pod
Troops
5 Tactical marines, grav pistol, meltagun
Drop pod
FA
10 Assault marines, vet sgt, powerfist
FA
10 Assault marines, vet sgt, powerfist
FA
Storm Talon - skyhammer m/l
_______
1500
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Post by treadiculous on Oct 21, 2014 3:20:20 GMT -5
Why not a chaplain with jump pack if you are going with an assault army?
I'm intrigued by the thunder-hammer too... this squad seems built for close combat with walkers; surely the melta bombs will be enough?
It looks like a powerful list.
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Post by cheminhaler on Oct 21, 2014 13:34:59 GMT -5
A chaplain is a good idea - lose a wound, gain a crozius and the Zealot rule... I'm also thinking an auspex would be better on an assault character to slightly reduce a target squad cover save.
Only the sgt has thunderhammer/ boltpistol/ melta bombs so he'd only get one shot at a walker. If its a Morkanaught with a power field projector they'll all be toast within a round.
But actually you are thinking on the right track with the melta bomb squad; you can get 4 melta bombs instead of a lascannon in fact. Looking through codex SM the day before yesterday, I quickly found that the ONLY type of squad that can all have melta bombs are Vanguard Veterans. For other squads only sgts can take them.
The way that jump packs work now only raven guard can use them in the movement and assault phase. Everyone else moves in one phase or the other. Means you can't deep strike and charge straight in, so they might be better off on the table, if they can survive a turn or three.
So the following 2 squads are brill in my opinion. I might already be assembling one of these. The main inspiration was your birthday marine assault.
10 Vanguard veterans - grav pistols x10, storm shields x10, melta bombs x10, jump packs x10 -570
10 Vanguard veterans - boltpistol, close combat weapon, melta bombs x10, jump packs x10 -270
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Post by treadiculous on Oct 21, 2014 14:52:02 GMT -5
can you give vanguard stormbolters?
Jump Storm Bolters are great!.. especially behind Storm shields..
..then deploy them by storm raven while firing typhoon missile launchers and waving thunder hammers.
(the norse gods will smile upon you)
I'd forgotten about the RG special rule.. it makes jump packs seriously awesome.
Crusader (as of the black templar rules) is also handy, the extra movement is very useful for jump marines.
However - you are imperial fists, so bolters and defenses are your friends.
I like the deathwind approach too. I wonder if the multi melta (and melta) is the best option for the 10 man tactical unit, it has a bit more range but the unit will still need to advance (unless you are planning on it behaving defensively). The powerfist is also seeming a bit overkill for this unit too, i guess it's useful against warbike riding ork warbosses and any other space marine captain that thinks it'll steal your base camp objective!
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Post by cheminhaler on Oct 21, 2014 15:10:25 GMT -5
No you can only give stormbolters to sternguard. It's like whoever wrote the current SM book just hates us! I guess when the multimeltas are in place there's not much they won't be able to target. Drop pod assault would put them in enemy lines to begin with. They lack flamers so they would get set back by lots of infantry platoon guard or ork boyz, if the opponent didn't take vehicles. That's why the single deathwind pod was essential but it might not be enough. (the norse gods will smile upon you) For Woden and the Emperor ?! |
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Post by treadiculous on Oct 21, 2014 15:52:06 GMT -5
How is the deathwind being used.. is this the FW drop pod full of typhoon missile launchers?
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Post by cheminhaler on Oct 21, 2014 17:16:38 GMT -5
They're not all that. I think its just 12" strength 5 Heavy, so they can't shoot on the turn they drop. After that, however, you're dropping large pie plates on guard infantry. The option for the deathwind m/l is in the drop pod kit, its not FW or a special upgrade or anything.
Trust me - I had this done to me the very last time I played with my Desert Rat Monkey guard. By the time I noticed what was happening it was too late and all it took to stop it was a plasma gun shot at the drop pod. At least my rough riders smashed terminator face, despite them still having saves.
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Post by emptyhat on Oct 21, 2014 17:41:37 GMT -5
Do those drop pods have the automatic fire rule?
Also, Morka shield is an invulnerable save vs shooting attacks only. (Not sure if it can save against its own gets hot rolls or not)
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Post by cheminhaler on Oct 21, 2014 17:53:43 GMT -5
No they're just BS 4 immobile vehicles. The Inertial guidance system rule is just to avoid deep strike mishap on the way in.
Scout bikers or scout infantry are another way to get terminators on the board with 100% accuracy, if you take locator beacons. Unfortunately I can take neither scouts, nor terminators.
Wait. You're telling me the shield won't work vs my assault suicide squad? That'll make them a target priority :S
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Post by cheminhaler on Nov 3, 2014 16:02:36 GMT -5
How's this?
Raven Guard chapter tactics ; the two tactical squads outflank on foot, the rest is on the table. Scouts Infiltrate into a high cover vantage point.
Space Marines 1500 points
HQ
Chaplain - jump pack, grav pistol, melta bombs - 125
Elite
10 Vanguard Veterans - jump packs, grav pistols x2, boltpistol x3, thunder hammer x5, stormshields x10 - 550
Troops
10 Tactical marines - vet sgt; meltabombs, meltagun, multimelta - 175
Troops
10 Tactical marines - vet sgt; meltabombs, meltagun, multimelta - 175
Troops
5 Scouts - bolters - XX
Fast Attack
10 Assault marines - veteran sgt; power weapon, melta bombs, flamers x2 - 210
Fast Attack
10 Assault marines - veteran sgt; power weapon, melta bombs, flamers x2 - 210
------
1500
Fast Attack
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Post by treadiculous on Nov 3, 2014 18:57:31 GMT -5
wow 10 storm shields... thats just crazy. c'mon now... be reasonable I mean; that's just loads of points spent on 3+++ isn't that a bit OTT?  ... (mine have 5 storm bolters at the back and the others have 5 close combat weapons) I was going to model 5 melta's on the inside of the storm-bolter equipped 'shields as the previous command squad rules meant you could take more than one gun and a storm shield. |
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Post by cheminhaler on Nov 4, 2014 14:47:25 GMT -5
They look mad... I always liked the metal poweraxe veteran on the right; I think I have that model somewhere.. Yeah 550 points is crazy... I might tone it down to 500 (which is two fully blown army expansions - considering I usually enlarge in 250 point increments) and just add in a squad, rather than make a whole new army. I've already assembled Squad Eagles, who have boltpistols, chainswords, melta bombs and jump packs. They're a suicide melta squad; much cheaper in points, die easily, but all have 4 attacks on the charge; if I get the whole squad in that'll be 40 attacks  Although vanguard aren't allowed stormbolters now, it's an easy change to make, if we wanted to make a unique White Templar unit entry that allowed stormbolters as a unit option, I'd be fine with that. They are assault weapons after all, so I can't see any reason vanguard can't take them. You could even go so far as to disallow Sternguard from your army in favour of all jump packing veterans. Stormbolters are excellent.. I officially tested out a squad of sternguard with 4 stormbolters and a heavy flamer in my last game vs Empty and the squad did well. The guy with the heavy flamer did nothing with that but he did help out in an assault vs Deffkoptaz. Stormbolters are great with IF chapter tactics  Later on in the game the sterguard sgt was challenged by a chaos lord, accepted, was killed and died. What I didn't know at the time, in the current rules if you are challenged by a solo dude/ monster and the rest of the squad are standing around doing nothing, they shouldn't be. In other words there are no Queensbury Rules challenges, if you are alone and you challenge, you might as well not bother as the whole squad will attack you anyway.  |
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Post by emptyhat on Nov 4, 2014 22:47:33 GMT -5
Yeah, declining a challenge basically costs a Space Marine nothing in 7th. I think Chaos characters are obliged to issue a challenge though and it was one of my mission objectives.
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Post by cheminhaler on Nov 5, 2014 15:02:31 GMT -5
Even if he accepts the rest of the squad should still have fought. That's what I meant by challenges not being fair if everyone in the squad is hitting you, along with the person you challenged.
That Boons of Chaos chart is pretty good. You need to get into cc straight away next time. The way that your Lord ended up with a strength 8 plasma pistol and improved BS had good synergy, but it was at the end of Turn 7.
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Post by emptyhat on Nov 5, 2014 15:48:14 GMT -5
That's deploying from reserve onto the short edge of a 6' board and riding a walker for you. Are you basing the challenge stuff on the lack of a certain paragraph that seems to have gone missing since 6th? I couldn't see anything beyond the fact that challengers are moved to base contact and must allocate wounds to the challenge before they hit anyone else.
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Post by cheminhaler on Nov 5, 2014 16:58:44 GMT -5
It's the 'Outside Forces' rule, right at the top of page 103.
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Post by Aeon on Dec 23, 2014 19:09:58 GMT -5
You should use Chapter Master Smash Fukker. He is the nastiest, meanest, rapiest chapter master in the game
Chapter Master
Space Marine bike
Thunder hammer or Burning blade
Shield Eternal
Artificer armor
Bike Command Squad
Apothecary
Champion
Grav gun
That is super assaulty. And you can run Some assault Marines with him to jump in behind him, supported by some scout snipers or tactical Marines
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Post by cheminhaler on Dec 26, 2014 17:17:48 GMT -5
I don't know if chapter masters can take command squads (Vs honour guard I mean), so I'll have to check on that.
Otherwise bikers in general look solid, especially melta guns or grav guns on bikes. You can even take an apothecary and 4 bikers with 4 grav guns for solid termie killing action. I have a new 5 bikers plus attack bike but they will be imperial fist tactics, not white scar, which is ultimate for bikers.
Grav guns were disappointing today in a game of astartes vs astartes, though they killed a couple of termies in one turn, I think. I wasn't using them, I was on the receiving end.
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