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Post by WestRider on Nov 10, 2012 0:20:22 GMT -5
We've been over this before, it's basic math. Even tho things have improved somewhat, there are still something like three times as many people looking for work as there are jobs available. Even if every single one of those jobs is filled, that leaves millions of people unemployed.
And most of those jobs don't actually pay a living wage. There's no state in the Union where someone can find affordable housing on a Minimum Wage job without some amazing luck. I'm not sure, maybe you've been homeless, but do you know how hard it is to keep yourself presentable for a job, and well-rested and capable of doing well at it, when you're living in your car, or on the street, because you got a job, but it still doesn't pay enough to put down first, last, and security deposit on an apartment?
And yes, I've seen plenty of panhandlers and homeless people who straight up cannot hold down a job. People broken in mind and/or body who are genuinely incapable of consistently doing a proper day's work. It happens. Even more who might be able to hold one down, but will never be able to get one, because they don't look presentable enough, because their mailing address/contact phone number is a homeless shelter, or because they have some minor conviction and the job market is so tight right now that no employer will touch anyone with a criminal record of any sort. Hell, it sometimes even gets self-reinforcing, because what plenty of those people have on their records are arrests for vagrancy, which lock them out of the job market and condemn them to further homelessness.
The standard for maintaining Unemployment benefits, last I checked, was 5 contacts per week, at least 3 of which needed to be new applications. When I was unemployed in '06, I applied at 4+ places per day* for four months without finding a job. Without the charity of friends and family, I would have died in a gutter sometime in '07 or '08. Hell, the only reason I eventually did find a job is that I moved back to my hometown and was able to take advantage of nepotism. Three out of the four jobs I've had since then, I got because the person doing the hiring knew someone else in my family, and the other I got because of a connection through a former co-worker.
My current job pays about the same as a full-time minimum wage job. I can barely support myself on what I make here. If I were a parent, there's no way I would be able to take care of myself and even one child on what I earn. This links back to what I said earlier about jobs not paying a living wage, and there being more applicants than jobs: If each person needs more than one of that already insufficient number of jobs to actually be able to make a living, that, through simple arithmetic, leaves even more people entirely out of a job.
*That's even toward the end of that period, when most of the openings I was seeing were places I already had applications on file. I'm not counting re-applications in there, just new jobs that I hadn't applied for already.
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Post by Rook on Nov 10, 2012 0:44:55 GMT -5
Again I have to totally disagree about the minimum wage. My mortgage is $424 a month. $424 divided by $8 is a measly 53 hours. I have in the past easily afforded my house.
Given that there are 18(workable hours in a day) multiplied by 30 days multiplied by $8 an hour is=$4320 a MONTH!!!. None of which are paid overtime btw.
That is only minimum wage. So yes...you can make good money working just minimum wage.
You can say 'it's basic math' but that is all a fallacy. Look at what unemployment is at today and where it was ten years ago. There haven't been that many people brought into this world in those ten years so that too many people thing is a fallacy.
Homeless people can get cleaned up if they want to. Gas stations have running water. The lack of a residence will prove a hurdle I agree. If they have mental disorders again that would be a hurdle as well.
*Simply put; where there is a will there is a way. I'm working three jobs right now, I work every day. But I set my self up for success on the housing market. I'm a breed apart from the norm I guess.
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Post by Rook on Nov 10, 2012 10:19:00 GMT -5
The true test of a person character is how they stand during test of adversity - Unknown
The hardest struggle of all is to be something different from what the average man is. – Charles M Schwab
You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist. - Friedrich Nietzsche
"The whole secret of existence is to have no fear. Never fear what will become of you, depend on no one. Only the moment you reject all help are you freed." - Buddha
What if a demon were to creep after you one night, in your loneliest loneliness, and say, 'This life which you live must be lived by you once again and innumerable times more; and every pain and joy and thought and sigh must come again to you, all in the same sequence. The eternal hourglass will again and again be turned and you with it, dust of the dust!' Would you throw yourself down and gnash your teeth and curse that demon? Or would you answer, 'Never have I heard anything more divine'? - Friedrich Nietzsche
“If you think you have it tough, read history books.” - Bill Maher
"Our greatest weakness lies in giving up. The most certain way to succeed is always to try just one more time." - Thomas Edison
And I saved the best for last because it brought tears to my eyes when I read it.
"Let me tell you something you already know. The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It is a very mean and nasty place and it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ain't how hard you hit; it's about how hard you can get hit, and keep moving forward. How much you can take, and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done. Now, if you know what you're worth, then go out and get what you're worth. But you gotta be willing to take the hit, and not pointing fingers saying you ain't where you are because of him, or her, or anybody. Cowards do that and that ain't you. You're better than that!"- Movie Quote from 'Rocky Balboa'
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Post by WestRider on Nov 10, 2012 14:45:58 GMT -5
Again I have to totally disagree about the minimum wage. My mortgage is $424 a month. $424 divided by $8 is a measly 53 hours. I have in the past easily afforded my house. Given that there are 18(workable hours in a day) multiplied by 30 days multiplied by $8 an hour is=$4320 a MONTH!!!. None of which are paid overtime btw. That is only minimum wage. So yes...you can make good money working just minimum wage. You can say 'it's basic math' but that is all a fallacy. Look at what unemployment is at today and where it was ten years ago. There haven't been that many people brought into this world in those ten years so that too many people thing is a fallacy. Homeless people can get cleaned up if they want to. Gas stations have running water. The lack of a residence will prove a hurdle I agree. If they have mental disorders again that would be a hurdle as well. *Simply put; where there is a will there is a way. I'm working three jobs right now, I work every day. But I set my self up for success on the housing market. I'm a breed apart from the norm I guess. - If one can obtain multiple minimum wage jobs (which can often be inordinately difficult, especially for those who have children to care for, are reliant on Public Transport, and/or have scheduling problems between those jobs, or with other requirements like classes so they can eventually get a better job), that's true. But a single full time minimum wage job leaves someone paying an unsustainably high proportion of their income on housing, anywhere in this country. - No, the population hasn't increased by that much. The remainder of the difference is due to Jobs that have been transferred to other countries or eliminated entirely. In the latter years of the Bush Presidency, the total number of jobs available in this country absolutely plummeted. - I'm a breed apart from the norm I guess. I want to separate this out because it's one of the key points here. Yes, you are. You are stronger and better than the vast majority of humanity. Despite what it says in the Declaration of Independence, all men are not created equal, and it is just as unfair to expect to expect a lesser man than yourself to shoulder the burdens of this life as easily as you do as it is to expect a man half your size to shoulder as heavy a backpack.
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Post by RedsandRoyals on Nov 10, 2012 17:03:30 GMT -5
Discuss this in another thread, guys.
Reds
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Post by WestRider on Nov 10, 2012 21:35:31 GMT -5
OK, one that's on topic: “Gay marriage legalized on the same day as marijuana makes perfect biblical sense. Leviticus 20:13: ‘A man who lays with another man should be stoned.’ Our interpretation has just been wrong for all these years” — George Takei
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Post by Rook on Nov 10, 2012 23:02:25 GMT -5
I'm a breed apart from the norm I guess. I want to separate this out because it's one of the key points here. Yes, you are. You are stronger and better than the vast majority of humanity. Despite what it says in the Declaration of Independence, all men are not created equal, and it is just as unfair to expect to expect a lesser man than yourself to shoulder the burdens of this life as easily as you do as it is to expect a man half your size to shoulder as heavy a backpack. I really hope you are joking when you say that. It certainly isn't the way I see it. One of my points, I feel, of being on this forum is to help uplift and support you guys/gals. At my core I may be slightly different but everyone here is capable of doing immense powerful things. WE all have the power! Everything else you posted I agree with.
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Post by Kommissar Orren on Nov 11, 2012 11:21:35 GMT -5
(PLaying CoH with a trainer active.)(Also in a condensed format, because I have a tendancy to post 2 words at a time on Steam.)
Orren: 709 kills, over 1400 losses. Reds: Did you win, or give up? Orren: I won. INFANTRY WAVE! Reds: That sound very British. Orren: Over 1300 casualties, and the enemy only killed 1103. I think I killed over 200 of my own men and only 578 enemy soldiers. Reds: Sir Douglas Haig would be proud.
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Post by Rolling Thunder on Nov 11, 2012 14:15:15 GMT -5
[Arrrgh Historical myth rage]
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Post by Bryant on Nov 11, 2012 23:42:36 GMT -5
Me, talking to my friend Alex while in lunch.
Alex: I'm stupid.
I can respond to this in many ways, however, as Alex is a girl, I have to be careful.
Me: No you're not, I am.
Alex: No you aren't. How are you?
Me: Meh...... tobacco use?
Alex: Oh.... then yeah, you are.
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Post by Adam Selene on Nov 19, 2012 4:47:14 GMT -5
(PLaying CoH with a trainer active.)(Also in a condensed format, because I have a tendancy to post 2 words at a time on Steam.) Orren: 709 kills, over 1400 losses. Reds: Did you win, or give up? Orren: I won. INFANTRY WAVE! Reds: That sound very British. Orren: Over 1300 casualties, and the enemy only killed 1103. I think I killed over 200 of my own men and only 578 enemy soldiers. Reds: Sir Douglas Haig would be proud. I know Erich von Falkenhayn would be proud. Bleed the enemy army white.
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Post by Kommissar Orren on Nov 22, 2012 14:34:18 GMT -5
Happy turkey day everyone! Here's a couple things I'm thankful for. ...and thankful for the native Americans who were kind enough to "give" us this country. I mean, the whole place for some beads and blankets? What a deal! Sorry about the blankets btw - Logan (One of my FB friends from ROTC.)
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Post by ElegaicRequiem on Nov 22, 2012 21:52:27 GMT -5
Not like they lad a continent-obliterating disease that set up up for conquest. Providence!
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Post by WestRider on Nov 22, 2012 22:58:44 GMT -5
"Oy vey, again with the smiting!" - While talking with my grandmother about the Old Testament this afternoon.
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Post by dangerrod on Nov 23, 2012 4:19:06 GMT -5
"A man can die but once"
- Bill Shakespeare
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Post by Bryant on Dec 15, 2012 19:47:57 GMT -5
Quote from an unknown source about the shooting, "Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single victim of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."
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Post by Adkenpachi on Dec 15, 2012 20:17:12 GMT -5
I dont think his face has been on our news much if atall... Ive never heard of either of those two men... And your gun control is laughable if it wasnt so seriously stupid. All that aside that is a good message.
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Post by Julian Sharps on Dec 15, 2012 20:24:06 GMT -5
Quote from an unknown source about the shooting, "Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single victim of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news." Pretty sure that's Morgan Freeman.
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Post by Bryant on Dec 15, 2012 20:32:17 GMT -5
Quote from an unknown source about the shooting, "Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single victim of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news." Pretty sure that's Morgan Freeman. It was n an article about the school shooting here in CT.
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Post by Rook on Dec 15, 2012 22:04:07 GMT -5
And your gun control is laughable if it wasnt so seriously stupid Which is the crowning achievement of this country. If you lived here you would understand that your comment isn't really an insult. Having firearms has never really been a problem in MY life. Of course I'm not batnuts crazy.
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Post by WestRider on Dec 15, 2012 22:19:46 GMT -5
The problem in this country has never been the access to firearms. It's been a (relatively) few people's willingness to embrace violence against others as the solution to problems that exist only in their own heads.
I read something from someone earlier, something about wishing that is were as easy to get mental health services as it is to get firearms. I entirely agree, but my agreement is all in the direction of improving access to care for mental illness.
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Post by ElegaicRequiem on Dec 15, 2012 22:21:10 GMT -5
If psycho wants a gun, psycho gets a gun. Doesn't matter when or where - country or laws mean nothing to people who would commit such an act.
On one side, we do keep a lot of guns out of the hands of people who don't deserve them. On the other, we let some people have them when we shouldn't. Who should suffer to make it right? What will make it right?
All nonsense! This is a thread about good quotes!
"I've got better things to do tonight then die!" - Springer, Transformers the Movie
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Post by WestRider on Dec 15, 2012 22:29:22 GMT -5
“You don’t need help, Warden. You are the help.”
- Jim Butcher, Cold Days
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Post by Julian Sharps on Dec 16, 2012 2:07:06 GMT -5
"Question one: Why do apples fall to the ground?" "How should I know!? Ask the apples!"
Oh, Sailor Moon, needing a talking cat to explain gravity to her...
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Post by scotti88 on Dec 16, 2012 2:24:58 GMT -5
I eat green berets for breakfast..........
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