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Post by ElegaicRequiem on Mar 31, 2010 19:58:46 GMT -5
Mmm... the =I= really should be separate. I'd hate to see them go entirely, though.
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Post by Gabriel Lupus on Apr 1, 2010 6:50:45 GMT -5
Yeah, I can understand the wish to have them seperately - and it would make sense for them to be seperate.
If they're still going to allow Inquisitors to join any Imperial force (which makes sense), maybe include them in a mini-dex with assassins? Or just have them as a White Dwarf article. That way you're allowing players to use the =I= in any force they want to, while keeping a distinction between the Inquisition and Grey Knights/Sisters/Deathwatch.
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Post by cheminhaler on Apr 1, 2010 14:33:07 GMT -5
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Post by Gabriel Lupus on Apr 1, 2010 15:28:55 GMT -5
hmmm kinky shaped rumours there...
The Stormie/arbite rumour is, for me, probably the most interesting - the option to do an Arbite task force would probably be too tempting to resist.
Now, this is going to seem like a bit of a U-turn compared to what I said earlier, but thinking about it, the only really viable way of keeping Inquisitors in 40k is to include them in the Grey Knights/SoB/Deathwatch codex(es). Why? well: 1) White Dwarf is highly unlikely torun any form of article regarding what I suggested earlier - it just isn't done anymore (sadly) and I think it would suffer from similar issues to the "BA WD codex" and also be something that people would refuse to allow you to use (for their own bizarre reasons) 2) You won't get an Inquisitors Minidex/Codex - afterall, the armies involved would be Imperial ones that already have their own codexes 3) GW apparently will NOT be making any minis outdated anymore (still waiting for this to be proven, but I both like and dislike this - like Inquisitors staying, dislike some of the "we'll invent this because it's powerful" units)
The only worry I have regarding a codex Inquisition is that, with the amount it would have to cover, things might suffer from being "watered down" to save space, and also, will an Inquisitor still be able to be join imperial armies...
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Post by ElegaicRequiem on Apr 1, 2010 18:54:21 GMT -5
3) GW apparently will NOT be making any minis outdated anymore (still waiting for this to be proven, but I both like and dislike this - like Inquisitors staying, dislike some of the "we'll invent this because it's powerful" units) *cough* Lord Solar *cough*
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Post by Gabriel Lupus on Apr 2, 2010 4:51:20 GMT -5
Good point Req - though you could still use the model as a Company Commander I suppose... Not sure what you could use Inquisitors, Land Raider Redeemers (tut tut), or Drop Pods as other than what they were designed for... maybe thats the kind of thing they were referring to? Bit conditional if that's the case.
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Post by cheminhaler on Apr 2, 2010 9:50:35 GMT -5
The odd SC dropping off the map won't harm anyone. Schaeffer and Macharius can easily be readapted to 5th. What bothers me is things like : your rough riders can have voxcasters one minute, then they can't the next.
No mention of SoB in that 'combined' codex, but Deathwatch is hardly something you can make a whole codex out of. It will be unusual to see D/W and G/K working together in the same army, though.
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Post by Gabriel Lupus on Apr 2, 2010 13:17:34 GMT -5
The odd SC dropping off the map won't harm anyone. Schaeffer and Macharius can easily be readapted to 5th. What bothers me is things like : your rough riders can have voxcasters one minute, then they can't the next. I think this is closer to what was being suggested... No mention of SoB in that 'combined' codex, but Deathwatch is hardly something you can make a whole codex out of. It will be unusual to see D/W and G/K working together in the same army, though. I can't really see them putting all three chamber militant in one Codex happening to be honest... maybe something akin to the old "Angels of Death" double codex from 2nd ed? It's issues like this that make me question the validity of such codex rumours though... I agree with you that Deathwatch would be an un likely stand alone codex. But then they've pretty much always been small strike forces of 1 to 2 squads - probably a reason Codex: Alien Hunters never got made.
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Post by cheminhaler on Apr 3, 2010 7:27:18 GMT -5
But why do we always classify the SoB as =I= troops?
I thought they were Ecclesiarchy first, but obviously the =I= use them, just like they use the Arbites, Astartes, Guard, Navy and Mechanicus.
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Post by Melissia on Apr 3, 2010 12:56:22 GMT -5
But why do we always classify the SoB as =I= troops? I don't. Because they aren't.
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Post by WestRider on Apr 3, 2010 13:10:12 GMT -5
The Sisters aren't Inquisitorial Troops. They just got shoved in to the WitchHunters Dex because of a quirk of organization.
Actually, I think if the Sisters got spun off into their own Dex, the rest of the Inquisitorial stuff would fit pretty well in one Dex, with all three Ordos together.
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Post by Melissia on Apr 3, 2010 13:12:58 GMT -5
No, the Witch Hunters got shoved into the Sisters of Battle codex. The Ssiters, unlike the Inquisition, already had a second edition codex, and were slated to have a third ed one-- but then they decided they wanted to advertise for their Inquisitor game and stuffed the Inquisition in copied blatantly from the Daemonhunters codex with a few minor changes-- GW's upper level employees such as Jervis Johnsom openly admit this. The majority of the codex, both fluff and army list, are Sisters/Ecclesiarchy, not Inquisition.
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Post by WestRider on Apr 3, 2010 13:27:43 GMT -5
I was speaking more just of the taxonomy of the situation. To flip it around a bit, they'd decided they wanted to do Dexes for the different Ordos, and couldn't figure out any way to make the Hereticus work other than giving them Sisters.
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Post by Melissia on Apr 3, 2010 13:29:10 GMT -5
... which amounts to stuffing the Inquisition in the third edition Sisters of Battle codex.
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Post by WestRider on Apr 3, 2010 13:33:55 GMT -5
Yes. Semantics =/= reality. I'm just talking about the first, really.
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Post by Melissia on Apr 3, 2010 14:54:29 GMT -5
Which is kinda pointless
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Post by Gabriel Lupus on Apr 3, 2010 15:18:46 GMT -5
Melissia is (as usual when it comes to SoB stuff) quite correct here. Although the Ordo Hereticus was developed in the background/fluff, one of the few reasons (other than those mentioned) that GW decided to try and slot the two together was because of the passage regarding Sisters of Battle purging some Space Marines for Heresy. What it doesn't mantion is that this was most likely some form of Heresy against the Ecclesiarchy. Because this seemed to fit quite closely (but nowhere near exactly) into the Ordo Hereticus fluff BAM! suddenly SoB are the Ordo Hereticus chamber Militant Don't get me wrong - I love the Ordo Hereticus, I just think they work better as either lonesome figures (with retinues - not armies) rooting out Heresy in Imperial society, or as Inquisitors that requisition armies/troops/inquisitorial Stormies. Malleus really kind of need the Grey Knights, Xenos really benefit from Deathwatch, Hereticus... Arbites and storm troopers (in my eyes).
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Post by Melissia on Apr 14, 2010 18:46:45 GMT -5
Apparently rumors are going around that the default Grey Knights armor is going to be Artificer Armor.
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Post by Gabriel Lupus on Apr 14, 2010 19:00:23 GMT -5
Really? Well I suppose that could work... would be a viable replacement to their "Aegis Suits" rules I suppose... but also sick and wrong...
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Post by Rolling Thunder on Apr 14, 2010 19:41:56 GMT -5
Dante. Sanguinary Guard. Sanguinary Priests. All deep-striking artificer-armoured feel-no-pain models, all with jump packs, AP4 boltguns, and enough close combat abilities to make Khorne cry.
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Post by ElegaicRequiem on Apr 14, 2010 19:56:16 GMT -5
All armies coming out lately seem to be of the 'hit harder, and have better armor' variety. Except for IG, which simply hit harder and faster.
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Post by Melissia on Apr 14, 2010 20:20:54 GMT -5
No,n what IG does is it hits harder, and then just to make sure it hits harder again. The IG are the hammer of the Emperor, and no army hammers the enemy better than the Guard.
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Post by Gabriel Lupus on Apr 15, 2010 2:20:19 GMT -5
There does seem to be a theory of tougher/harder hitting stuff recently, but something just seems so familiar about all this... something that was around a long time ago (talking 2nd ed kind of time). I'm actually quite enjoying it all to be honest - I don't see it as a negative thing at all. Not sure why, but it all seems balanced/acceptable to me.
Thinking more about the artificer armor Grey Knights, I'm actually really liking this idea. For one, it'll make the Grey Knights a real force to be reckoned with - something which really fits their fluff well. It will also mean that they don't need to have lot's of unique rules (aka aegis suits etc) to make them work - which for me, is another good move.
Yep, I'm getting really excited about this stuff... I wonder if Grey Knight Terminators will get a similar buff... like 4+ Invulnerable for all their Terminators (and 3+ Invulnerable for Storm shields too)
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Post by Gabriel Lupus on Apr 16, 2010 5:36:17 GMT -5
Just wondering what effect this would have regarding Dreadnoughts... no aegis rule, better power armour... higher Dreadnought armour values?
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Post by Hetfiltrator on Apr 16, 2010 18:02:52 GMT -5
Just wondering what effect this would have regarding Dreadnoughts... no aegis rule, better power armour... higher Dreadnought armour values? Grey Knight Ironclads?
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