AHHHHHH!!!! (space marines and tau v.s. imperial

[sniperbob]

It was a 6000 point game, I will make this short because it was short. I was holding a town and the enemy was attacking out of the forest. The tau took out 2 sentinels and a whole squad of infantry in the first turn, also they immobilized my baneblade and moved into the town. In the second turn some of the space marines which were played by another person turned on the other space marines and tau. It was his first ever game and he didn't lose a single guy! some terminators deep striked behind my baneblade, command squad, 2 heavy weapons, and 2 squads with chimeras and just decimated my forces. The only thing I managed to kill in the entire game was 1 tau guy and 4 devastators. Also, about %75 of my d6 rolls were 1's.

[-∞∞-]

That's the way the dice roll. Sometimes you get 6, but more often you get 1. Personally, I can't stand things like deep strikes, drop pods, stealth suits, etc. It totally violates the spirit of storming a town. You should have to go through the gates and prepare for the enemy onslaught rather than just showing up behind them. That's why, when I play among friends, we agree to ban those types of things and allow the attacker to have a larger force than the defender. Better luck next time.

[Ymmot (M.I.A)]

but it is the 41st mellinium, deep strikers, droppods, and stealth suits are all part of the game and they all cost points making the games you play fair and blanaced with both sides taking equivalent sized forces.

most seiges are not won but storming the front gates anyhow, striking at defenders from a fortified position is suicide no matter how many superior numbers you bring, most of the are going to die trying to get inside, it may work eventually but it is going to be costly.

it pays to be a sneaky bastard.

[Rolling Thunder]

The quantity of firepower is always secondary to the positioning of that firepower:

Lit: While 10 terminators represents a sizeable and powerful force in game terms, mounting a frontal assault with them is grossly ineffectual. They will die in droves to heavy weapons fire, and be cut down by the veritable wall of laser fire any guardsman will put up in front of them. But behind your lines, they are far more useful.

I mean, what did you expect? Only an idiot (or someone who could equal our numbers- Nids and Orks) would try and engage a large Guard army frontally. 6,000 points of Guard is enough firepower to flatten a small city, let alone it's equivalent in Space Marine terms.

"Totally violates the spirit of storming a town"

What the moer are you talking about!? When you storm a town, you either have a vast superiority in men and material, or you sneak up on them/drop from the sky. That's how it works.

[-∞∞-]

I understand that these things help bring a realistic futuristic technology element to the games and gives the attackers a chance, but I just do see how it makes sense that nothing can defend against these kind of things. They've got a whole turn to destroy your weak rear flank/ armor, and can't be attacked until the next turn. Or in the case of units that can hit and run, this becomes more problematic. That's why I only play without them when I am among friends who share my dislike for them. I'm not going to go to a tournament and then complain when another player uses drop pods. That would just be annoying.

[Deleted]

Jan 2, 2009 17:15:30 GMT -5 -∞∞- said:

I understand that these things help bring a realistic futuristic technology element to the games and gives the attackers a chance, but I just do see how it makes sense that nothing can defend against these kind of things. They've got a whole turn to destroy your weak rear flank/ armor, and can't be attacked until the next turn. Or in the case of units that can hit and run, this becomes more problematic. That's why I only play without them when I am among friends who share my dislike for them. I'm not going to go to a tournament and then complain when another player uses drop pods. That would just be annoying.

Know your opponent's capabilities and always assume he/she knows your weak spots. This should be common sense to any commander out there, regardless of the army.

If you know a specific attack is coming, such as drop pods, stealth suits, etc always make sure you have some way to either prevent/handle/recover from such an attack. Each army has their unique abilities that seperate them from the others. If your enemy uses stealth, find a way to detect stealth or try to place your unit in a position that makes it difficult for someone to attack them from the rear. If your sides are open for an attack place more of your troops in an area that can assault deadspace.

So far, almost everything I've encountered in this game has had some kind of way to counter it, but I'm not talking about counters. What I'm really trying to say is you should try to look beyond the rulebooks/codexes and plan on how best to deal with a what would be considered a catastrophic disaster.

Never consider anything in your army so important that it cannot be lost at a moments notice. Always assume that you will lose a Leman Russ in a turn, if you don't then you're ahead. Always assume that your force is going to be cut down considerably each turn and you will have to drop back to consolidate, if not then continue to advance. This is regardless of how he attacks your troops. If he uses drop troops to take out a Leman russ, then he did exactly as you expected, which means you should already have a back up plan.

Once you learn to counter what your opponent might consider an unfair advantage, you've stripped all power from him. Victory goes to the most flexible.

[jeytryon]

so.. while we are on the topic of countering drop troop... my buddy has been slaughtering me with his droppod(s) full of sternguard veterans armed with heavy flamers and combimeltas, he also has kantor atatched to them. I have been going crazy trying to figure out a way to counter him. last time i hit him with a command sqad full of flamers, but it just wasn't enough. I think next time i will have some ogryns waiting for him with an attached commissar. I think i would need ten for it will work but will that be worth the points?

ps. if i should post this else where please let me know the best place, thanks!!

[Deleted]

well when you play against the SM, CSM, or Necrons with the nice armor saves they are paying that for like 3 infantry men, just get a few heavy weapons and bunker down, and pick off the fire warriors, not too hard, but yeah i beat a necrons army with the gurad.. but not w my tau army.. hmmm i love the guard now i feel they are the most versital army in the game, they adapt to who you play, so think about that next time (not that im saying you didnt... lol) but i just wanted to put my 2 sense in...

[norge187]

I can honestly say i have never played an apoc game myself. One thing I have learned though is that no matter what be prepared to have good interior lines. You must be able to deploy certain units with the ability to read and react. Hence why those command squads are so valuable. Sure you want your front lines to be strong. But you must insure your rear and interior lines are taken care during deployment.

Every squad and every special weapon serve a purpose during deployment. When creating your army list you must go through it with a fine tooth and comb to descern what each element's main goals are. Once that is established you are halfway to victory. After that once the first turn is done you will have to start all over because a battle plan only last's the first turn after that read and react.

[grimm]

The way to defeat a drop pod army is to utilize deep striking and infiltration/outflanking. If he's dropping in on your Leman Russes with drop pods and heavy flamers that need to find rear armor to tickle them, you can drop in with 10 man infantry squads and rapid fire the heck out of him.

Pure gunline guard is not the way to win games - you need some mobility.

[Rolling Thunder]

Deepstriking demo charges. Foolproof. Or not, as the case may be.

[Deleted]

If you want a unit(s) to deal with this kind of threat (at a tiny cost compared to the rest of your army) then look not further than a Guardsmen.
Select close order drill, get a platoon of a command squad with a SO w/ p. sword and a commisar similarily equiped, get a couple of squads with flamers and hold all of this behind you lines new what you know/consider to be the juiciest targets for an enemy to deep-strike behind. Now when his unit of termies (or whatever) comes in, they will slaughter whatever they are aimed at, but you sweep in with you back-line platoon, roast him then charge! You are charging in with about 50 attacks from your regular guardsmen alone, and 9 power sword attacks at initiative 5 (if in close order) at WS 4... put that in your pipe and smoke it 200+ point squad of termies to your about 200 point stack of versatile Guardsmen.

Well, tally-ho!

[Dutch]

Just think, that one Tau guy you killed couldve gone on to invent a new type of rail-ion-pulse lasblastamacannonwutsit - and now he can't because you killed him. The Emperors work is in everything.