Codex: Dark Eldar (5th ed) Collaboration Thread

[Julian Sharps]

After hearing the rumor that Lost and the Damned were getting a new codex (the second Space Marine-related codex in a row, grr...), I have decided to follow in Melissia's footsteps and write up a fandex for our favorite sadists, the Dark Eldar. This thread will not have the final product, it is merely a thread about discussing what should go into this new codex and how much it should cost. That said, feel free to throw in your two cents and contribute to the project.

I'll start off with (what I think) is a reasonable base list (Version 0.2.0):

All Dark Eldar Infantry, Jet Infantry and Jump Infantry models have Fleet.
All non-vehicle Dark Eldar models assault as if they were equipped with frag grenades.
Strategy Rating 3
In scenarios with an attacker and a defender, the Dark Eldar are always the attacker.

HQ:
0-1 Archon: 60 points
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
6 6 3 3 3 7 3 10 5+
Unit Type: Infantry (Independent Character)
Equipment: Splinter Pistol, Agonizer, Haywire Grenades, Shadow Field
Special Rules: Lightning Strike (Archite only), Evasion (4+ Invulnerable Save)
- Lightning Strike: This unit (but not any unit it joins unless it also has the Lightning Strike special rule) ignores the effects of cover in close combat.
Options: May take a Hellion Skyboard for +20 points or a Reaver Jetbike for +30 points
May take Incubus Retinue
May become an Archite (Sv 6+, +1 I, +1 A, replaces Agonizer for Wych weapon & Combat Drugs, Lightning Strike special rule, may take Wych retinue instead of Incubus) for +15 points
May take Soul-Seeker Ammunition for +5 points
May replace Splinter Pistol and/or Agonizer for one of the following:
- Scissorhand for +25 points
- Monomolecular Blade for +15 points
- Poisoned Blade for +5 points
- Hellglaive for +15 points
- Terrorfex for +10 points
- Shredder for +10 points
- Blaster for +15 points

Dracon: 35 points
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
5 5 3 3 2 6 3 9 5+
Unit Type: Infantry (Independent Character)
Equipment: Splinter Pistol, CCW, Haywire Grenades
Special Rules: Lightning Strike (Dracite only), Evasion (4+ Invulnerable Save)
- Lightning Strike: This unit (but not any unit it joins unless it also has the Lightning Strike special rule) ignores the effects of cover in close combat.
Options: May take Hellion Skyboard (Jump Infantry) for +20 points or Reaver Jetbike (Jetbike) for +30 points
May become a Dracite (Sv 6+, +1 I, +1 A, replaces CCW for Wych weapon & Combat Drugs, Lightning Strike special rule, may take Wych retinue) for +15 points
May take Soul-Seeker Ammunition for +5 points
May replace Splinter Pistol and/or CCW for one of the following:
- Agonizer for +15 points
- Monomolecular Blade for +15 points
- Poisoned Blade for +10 points
- Hellglaive for +15 points
- Terrorfex for +10 points
- Shredder for +10 points
- Blaster for +15 points

Haemonculus: 30 points
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
5 4 3 4 2 5 3 9 5+
Unit Type: Infantry (Independent Character)
Equipment: Agonizer, Stinger
Special Rules: Evasion (4+ Invulnerable Save)
Options: May take Reaver Jetbike for +30 points
May replace Agonizer and/or Stinger for one of the following:
- Monomolecular Blade for +15 points
- Destructor for +20 points
- Scissorhand for +25 points

Incubi Retinue: 125 points
Incubus:
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
5 5 3 3 1 5 2 9 3+
Unit Type: Infantry
Composition: 5 Incubi
Equipment: Punisher, Tormentor Helm
Options: Must be taken as a retinue for an Archon or Dracon.
May take Soul-Seeker Ammunition for entire squad for +10 points
Any Incubus may replace its Punisher and/or Tormentor Helm for one of the following:
- Splinter Cannon for +15 points
- Terrorfex for +10 points
- Shredder for +10 points
- Dark Lance for +20 points
- Blaster for +15 points
- Disintegrator for +25 points
The entire squad may take skyboards for +20 points or Reaver Jetbikes for +30 points. If the Archon or Archite is mounted on a Skyboard or Reaver, the entire Incubus squad must be mounted on the same kind. Instead of the weapon upgrade options listed above, Incubi on Skyboards or Reavers have the same weapon upgrade options as normal units of Hellions or Reavers, respectively.

Elites:
Warp Beast Pack: 75 points
Beastmaster:
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
5 4 3 3 1 6 2 8 6+
Warp Beast:
4 0 4 3 1 5 3 3 6+
Unit Type: Beast (even the Beastmaster)
Composition: 1 Beastmaster and 3 Warp Beasts
Equipment: Beastmaster: Wych Weapon, Splinter Pistol, Combat Drugs
Warp Beasts count has having Lightning Claws
Special Rules: Lightning Strike, Evasion (4+ Invulnerable Save)
- Lightning Strike: This unit (but not any characters joining it unless they also have the Lightning Strike special rule) ignores the effects of cover in close combat.
Options: May take up to 2 additional Warp Beasts (20 points each)

Grotesques: 100 points
Grotesque:
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
5 0 4 4 2 5 4 10 -
Unit Type: Infantry
Composition: 5 Grotesques
Equipment: Scissorhand, Combat Drugs
Special Rules: Feel No Pain
Options: May take up to 5 additional Grotesques (20 points each)

Mandrake: 100 points
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
5 4 3 3 1 5 3 8 5+
Unit Type: Infantry
Composition: 5 Mandrakes
Equipment: 2x Poisoned Blades
Special Rules: Shadow Skin, Evasion (4+ Invulnerable Save)
- Shadow Skin: +2 to all Cover Saves, deploys as per Deep Strike rules, except no scatter roll is necessary, no Dangerous Terrain rolls are made, but the unit may not deploy any closer than 1" to an enemy unit.
Options: May take up to 5 additional Mandrakes (20 points each)

Troops:
Wych Team: 70 points
Wych:
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
4 4 3 3 1 6 2 8 6+
Succubus:
4 4 3 3 1 6 3 9 6+
Unit Type: Infantry
Composition: 1 Succubus and 4 Wyches
Equipment: Wych Weapon, Splinter Pistol, Combat Drugs, Haywire Grenades
Special Rules: Lightning Strike, Evasion (4+ Invulnerable Save)
- Lightning Strike: This unit (but not any characters joining it unless they also have the Lightning Strike special rule) ignores the effects of cover in close combat.
Options: May take up to 15 additional Wyches (10 points each)
Must take either a Raider (if the squad numbers 10 models or less) or equip the entire squad with Webway Portals (10 points per model)
Up to 4 Wyches may replace a Splinter Pistol for one of the following:
- Terrorfex for +10 points
- Shredder for +10 points
- Blaster for +15 points
- Monomolecular Blade for +15 points
- Poisoned Blade for +10 points
May replace the Succubus' Wych Weapon and/or Splinter Pistol for one of the following:
- Monomolecular Blade for +15 points
- Agonizer for +15 points
- Shredder for +10 points
- Poisoned Blade for +10 points
- Hellglaive for +15 points

Warrior Squad: 60 points
Warrior:
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
4 4 3 3 1 5 2 8 5+
Sybarite:
4 4 3 3 1 5 3 9 5+
Unit Type: Infantry
Composition: 1 Syrabite and 4 Warriors
Equipment: Splinter Rifle (Splinter Pistol & CCW for Sybarite), Haywire Grenades
Options: May take up to 15 additional Warriors (10 points each)
May take a Raider if the squad numbers 10 or less
Up to 4 Warriors may replace their Splinter Rifles for one of the following:
- Splinter Cannon for +5 points
- Terrorfex for +10 points
- Dark Lance for +20 points
- Disintegrator for +25 points
May replace the Sybarite's Splinter Pistol and/or CCW for one of the following:
- Monomolecular Blade for +15 points
- Agonizer for +15 points
- Blaster for +15 points
- Poisoned Blade for +10 points

Slaves: 100 points
Dark Eldar Slave:
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
2 2 3 3 1 3 1 5 -
Unit Type: Infantry
Composition: 20 Slaves
Equipment: CCW, Combat Drugs
Special Rules: Expendable, Feel No Pain, Fearless
- Expendable: Close combats involving no Dark Eldar units other than Slaves do not block Line of Sight for Dark Eldar units for purposes of shooting. In addition, Dark Eldar units may shoot into such combats as if they were not in close combat. Any casualties an enemy unit sustains in this way count towards combat resolution at the end of the Assault Phase.
Options: May take up to 30 additional Slaves (5 points each)
If a Haemonculus is in the army, may take Without Number for +75 points

Fast Attack:
Hellion: 100 points
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
4 4 3 3 1 6 2 8 5+
Succubus:
4 4 3 3 1 6 3 9 5+
Unit Type: Jump Infantry
Composition: 1 Succubus and 2 Hellions
Equipment: Hellglaive, Combat Drugs, Haywire Grenades
Special Rules: Deep Strike, Hit and Run, Evasion (4+ Invulnerable Save)
Options: May take up to 7 additional Hellions (30 points each)

Reaver: 120 points
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
4 4 4 4(3) 1 6 2 8 4+
Sybarite:
4 4 4 4(3) 1 6 3 9 4+
Unit Type: Jetbike
Composition: 1 Sybarite and 2 Reavers
Equipment: Splinter Pistol, CCW, Reaver Jetbike, Haywire Grenades
Options: May take up to 7 additional Reavers (30 points each)
Up to two Reavers may replace their Splinter Rifles (mounted on their Reaver Jetbikes) with one of the following:
- Splinter Cannon for +5 points
- Dark Lance for +20 points

Heavy Support:
Scourge: 115 points
WS BS S T W I A Ld Sv
4 5 3 3 1 5 2 8 5+
Sybarite:
4 5 3 3 1 5 3 8 5+
Unit Type: Jet Infantry
Composition: 5 Scourges
Equipment: Splinter Rifle (Sybarite has Splinter Pistol and CCW)
Special Rules: Deep Strike, Evasion (4+ Invulnerable Save)
Options: May take up to 5 additional Scourges (23 points each)
May take Soul-Seeker Ammunition for entire squad for +10 points
Up to four Scourges may replace their Splinter Rifles with one of the following:
- Splinter Cannon for +5 points
- Terrorfex for +10 points
- Dark Lance for +20 points
- Disintegrator for +25 points

Ravager: 70 points
BS FA SA RA
4 12 11 10
Type: Open-Topped Fast Skimmer
Equipment: 3x Dark Lances, Scythes
Options: May replace any Dark Lances with one of the following:
- Disintegrator for +5 points
May take a Night Shield for +15 points
May take Screaming Jets for +15 points
May take a Torture Amp for +10 points

Transports:
Raider: 40 points
BS FA SA RA
4 10 10 10
Type: Open-Topped Fast Skimmer
Equipment: Dark Lance, Scaling Nets
Transport Capacity: 10
Options: May replace the Dark Lance with one of the following:
- Disintegrator for +5 points
May take a Night Shield for +15 points
May take Screaming Jets for +15 points
May take a Torture Amp for +10 points
May take a Trophy Rack for +10 points
May take a Horrorfex for +5 points
May either take Scythes for +10 points, or Slave Snares for +15 points

Equipment:
Agonizer: Wounds on 3+, Power Weapon
Blaster: 12" S7 AP2 Assault 1, Melta
Combat Drugs: Furious Charge, +1 Attack, all close combat attacks Get Hot
Dark Lance: 36" S8 AP1 Heavy 1, Lance
Destructor: Template S6 AP3 Assault 1, Wounds on 2+
Disintegrator (Lob Shot): 36" S7 AP2 Heavy 1, Barrage, Melta, Blast
Disintegrator (Burst Fire): 24" S5 AP3 Heavy 3
Haywire Grenades: Grenade, Effects determined by a D6 roll: 1 = no effect, 2-5 = Glancing Hit, 6 = Penetrating Hit
Hellglaive: 12" S4 AP4 Assault 2, +1 Attack Power Weapon
Hellion Skyboard: Jump Pack, +1 to Armor Save
Monomolecular Blade: Power Weapon, denies Invulnerable Saves
Poisoned Blades: Wounds on 3+
Punisher: Power Fist, +D6 AP, no initiative penalties
Reaver Jetbike: Jetbike, built-in Splinter Rifle, +1 Armor Save
Scissorhand: Lightning Claw
Shadow Field: 2+ Invulnerable Save, save is lost if failed.
Shredder: Template S4 AP4 Pistol, Target's Initiative reduced by 1 if an unsaved wound is scored
Soul-Seeker Ammunition: Only for Splinter Cannons, Splinter Pistols, Splinter Rifles, Tormentor Helms and Hellglaives. Denies Cover Saves.
Splinter Cannon: 24" S5 AP4 Assault 4
Splinter Pistol: 12" S4 AP4 Pistol
Splinter Rifle: 24" S4 AP4 Assault 2
Stinger: 12" S4 AP4 Pistol, Wounds on 2+
Terrorfex (Wraithbone): 12" S- AP- Assault 1, Small Blast, if one or more models is hit, the unit they belong to must take a Leadership test or be Pinned. -1 Leadership penalty if the unit is below half strength, -1 per model hit if more than one model hit.
Terrorfex (Xenospasm): 12" S4 AP4 Assault 1, Small Blast, No Cover Saves, Pinning, -1 Leadership penalty per model hit
Tormentor Helm: 12" S4 AP4 Assault 1, +1 attack
Webway Portal: Deploy from reserve as per Deep Strike, but do not roll to scatter and unit may assault after deploying.
Wych Weapon: Power Weapon
Vehicle Upgrades:
Horrorfex: 12" S- AP- Assault 1, Small Blast, if one or more models is hit, the unit they belong to must take a Leadership test or be Pinned. -1 Leadership penalty if the unit is below half strength, -1 per model hit if more than one model hit, counts as a defensive weapon.
Night Shield: 3+ Cover Save, save is lost if failed.
Scaling Nets: Regardless of how far it has moved, any unit may embark on an empty Raider that moved over them as if the Raider was stationary. A model embarking in this way may not disembark that Movement Phase.
Screaming Jets: The model has the Scout special rule.
Scythes: Any model engaging in close combat with a vehicle with scythes immediately takes a Strength 5 hit if they roll a 1 to hit. Armor saves are allowed as normal.
Slave Snares: If a Raider moves over an enemy unit, that unit immediately taken D6 Strength 4 hits, with normal armor saves allowed.
Torture Amp: The model may tank shock as if it were a tank.
Trophy Racks: All enemy units within 6" of a Raider with a trophy rack take a -1 penalty to their Leadership values. The effect is not cumulative.

Does this seem reasonable so far?

[Ymmot (M.I.A)]

Not bad.

I like the idea of agonizers wounding on 3+ but I would like to see them remain power weapons, even if I had to pay 10 points extra from what they cost now.

Tormentor Helm adds +1 attack in close combat

Shadow Field only works until the 2+ save is failed.

[Julian Sharps]

Thanks, ymmoT. Seeing as I lack access to a copy of the DE 'dex, I was basing this entirely off of fluff, with some common sense thrown in.

As I was in a hurry when I was typing this, I should clarify the Expendable rule for Slaves: Units of Slaves do not provide the opponent with a cover save, and enemy units in close combat with a unit of Slaves do not count as blocking LoS and may be shot at as if they were not in close combat by Dark Eldar units.

[ElegaicRequiem]

Very interesting. I've been making (in my head) a remake of the current codex, just so that it was updated to 5th ed., as I understand the intentions of the author of the 'current' one.

And warp beasts are amazing, you should find a copy of the codex, and do them.

[Julian Sharps]

Well, I did a playtest on Vassal with point values largely based on what I thought was fair (using Guard and Blood Angels codexes as a base) against my Air Cav list (maybe not the best of plans). I figured that, since Dark Eldar don't really fight for strategic gain or territory, Kill Points should be played for in addition to mission objectives (although I think it would simply make more sense to make all Dark Eldar missions Annihilation-based. It would be simpler), and I based all vehicle upgrades (and costs) off the rules listed in Chapter Approved 2001. I'm adding the point costs to my original post.

The end result was an absolute slaughterfest. Their reserves didn't come in when they needed them, they didn't have enough AT to deal with Valk spam and even with a 4+ Invulnerable save, they just fell apart under all the guns the Guard could bring to bear against them. I've been considering boosting Evasion to a 3+ save, maybe dropping point costs a bit and giving at least some units other than Incubi decent AT close combat weapons (like krak grenades). Remember that I do not have access to the current codex, so I don't know how my point costs compare with the current ones.

[Ymmot (M.I.A)]

They already have wargear called haywire granades (1=miss 2-5=glance 6=pen)
Give your HQ a shadow field and leave evasion as it is


GIVE RAIDERS DARK LANCES!
with the option to swap to a disintegrators
(and you do not need to DS from them, they're open topped transports...you can assault after you dismebark...Deepstriking out of one leaves your unit standing around with nothing to do.)


give the Ravager the option to switch to disintegrators

give reavers splinter rifles with options to take additional special weapons

make splinter rifles poisoned weapons.(possibly)


make the punisher a powerfist that strikes at normal initiative.

[Julian Sharps]

Done with most of those (I'll post the changes when I've playtested them).

I don't know about automatically making Splinter Rifles poisoned weapons, but maybe a poisoned ammo upgrade?

As for Punishers, what if we were to make them more like Eviscerators (a nice Dark Eldar-style name for a weapon, huh)?

[cheminhaler]

I like the Slaves without number, on combat drugs. Raiders usually have dark lances, not splinter cannons..

[ElegaicRequiem]

Sharps, in 5th ed. DE excel most at last turn territory grab, and absolutely fail at KP, unless they can completely table the opponent.

They're more about hitting fast, not hard. They pin all enemy unit they can, and whittle away at the simpleton cowards...

[Ymmot (M.I.A)]

I probably wouldn't use slaves...the meat is too valuable to waste it on the battlefield.

give the Raiders the ability to take terrorfex launchers in addition to their normal loadout, once the initial dagger strike neutralizes the enemy's armor, the transport can set about pinning squads on foot while the rest of the army swoops in and starts cleaning up isolated targets.

[ElegaicRequiem]

Mmm... slaves are part of the after the battle party in Commoragh... No sense wasting their screams on the battlefield where they can't be fully appreciated.

[Hetfiltrator]

Oct 20, 2009 17:32:29 GMT -5 Julian Sharps said:

After hearing the rumor that Lost and the Damned were getting a new codex (the second Space Marine-related codex in a row, grr...)

Lost and Damned??? Aren't those those funny little mutant guys?
Do you mean Legion of the Damned?

Oct 20, 2009 17:32:29 GMT -5 Julian Sharps said:

Punisher: Thunder Hammer

Currently more effective than the tank.

Anywho ignoring my silly remarks you did an exelent job in this. By the way Sharps.....I didn't know you were into that stuff. Guess I know your next christmas present .

[Julian Sharps]

What, a bunch of Valks?

[Hetfiltrator]

Oct 23, 2009 12:01:53 GMT -5 Julian Sharps said:

What, a bunch of Valks?

No silly, a S&M bondage kit.

[ElegaicRequiem]

*Shudders*

Back to 40K...

[Julian Sharps]

*likewise shudders*

Yeah...

Anyways, the reason why I figure that Dark Eldar should be able to absolutely dominate in Kill Point games is because fluffwise, they don't squabble over petty things like land or monuments. They hit a location fast, they hit it hard, and then they leave. I figure they should be at about the same level as Space Marines in terms of numbers (slaves not withstanding, I'll get to them in a bit), but still be able to compete without wearing power armor (obviously, Dark Eldar are going to be more assault-oriented) or having any real armored vehicles.

My reasoning for the use of slaves as cannon fodder in a Dark Eldar force is simply an example of yet another one of their tricks to confuse and tie up their target so they can hit them (or another target) with impunity. It's more of a cost-benefit and risk analysis (I can't believe I'm actually using some of my high school Econ class...), attractive enough that the leading Archon decides it is worth it to throw away a bunch of slaves in anticipation of acquiring more than they would if they left those slaves in their pens/closets/wherever Dark Eldar stick 'em when they're not using them.

What if we were to give Raiders Scout?

[ElegaicRequiem]

Outflanking raiders? It fits with the fluff, but it would be WAY too good. That would be even better than a WWP for free... If you want to do that, make the screaming jet upgrade for raiders allow that instead of the less-than-worthless deep strike... Or make squads in raiders able to disembark and move normally after the thing deep-strikes.

[Julian Sharps]

Actually, I just thought of a better use for scaling nets: What if they allowed a unit to board an empty transport without the transport itself slowing down? Obviously, they wouldn't be allowed to disembark that same turn, but I think that would make for an interesting transport option.

[Hetfiltrator]

Ouch. It's like a school bus. For sadists. I think that would be a frightening addition. Unless Raiders can't outflank, and may only make scout movements, y'know like old scout bikers. They couldn't turboboost for their scout move....

OOC: Drat and double drat, Sharps, your christmas present is on hold until I'm 18......just kidding of course.

[ElegaicRequiem]

Ah, but is that out of character, or in it?

Haha, the DE are waiting for you to turn 18.

[Julian Sharps]

The Dark Eldar made a breakthrough!

After looking at my LGS's copy of the Dark Eldar codex, I realized that the points I had listed previously were across the board far too much (that's what I get for basing the point costs off of Blood Angels...), and made the appropriate changes along with Screaming Jets now granting Scout instead of Deep Strike. I then cooked up a list composed of an Archite and Dracite (both with Wych retinues), 4 more Wych squads, 6 Raiders to transport them in and a Ravager, and pitted them against my Mechanized list. The Guard were duly slaughtered, but a lone sentinel managed to survive (the game ended on turn 5, thank God). Needless to say, it was an absolute nightmare, the way it should be fighting Dark Eldar. Even with a Spearhead setup, the Wyches managed to get into close combat on turn 1 with minimal casualties (Guard somehow managed to get first turn), and proceeded to rack up kill point after kill point against my armored phalanx (the final score was Guard 7, Dark Eldar 14). The Archite managed to get 7 attacks on the charge (3 base for Archon, +1 for Archite stat boost, +1 for charging, +1 for 2 CCWs, +1 for combat drugs), all of which wounded on a 3+ and denied armor saves (yay, agonizers!).

I'll try it against my air cav list next, but it's nice to see that progress is being made.

Edit: I've put version 0.2 up on the first post, so you can see the new costs and stuff.

[ElegaicRequiem]

Looks a lot better, and more complete than before. I wonder about a few items of wargear... but that'll work itself out.

One thing that stands out though, is that warp beasts count as having lightning claws. That's way too good. Bring back the option to take up to five of them, and add an attack to their stats if you want them stronger, but four attacks each on the charge that re-roll to wound, and ignore armor saves is just wrong. Even if it's accurate to fluff...

[Julian Sharps]

Well, I tried the same list against my air cav, as promised. It was an incredibly messy game (as expected), but the Guard managed to narrowly win (Dark Eldar 12, Guard 14, 7 turns on Annihilation Pitched Battle).

I think the Wych cult side of things seems to work, I'll eventually cook up a Kabal list and see how that goes.

[Hetfiltrator]

Ohh, good job Sharps! I'll continue cheering you on when my marines are turned around.....They just keep staring.....

[ElegaicRequiem]

Won't stop them from knowing...